# Newbie looking at PA. Advice?



## spork (Jan 21, 2012)

Hi Joel.
I stopped cycling because my knee kept giving me grief after only 30k's or so. I find the pedal action of the Hobie much gentler on it.
I don't have a PA - I got the Revo instead, but people that do have the PA seem to love it.
How big are you? (height / weight) and whats your balance like? I'cm pretty unco, and can't stand in the revo, although some can. I went fishing with a bloke who has an outback the other day. He had no problems standing and (fly) casting from it. @ $1000 less and lighter / easier to manage off the water that might also be worth a look for you.
Your local Hobie dealer should be able to let you test "drive" and 'yaks in the range that interest you. As far as deals go - you can haggle, or ask for extras. Don't count on them though...
3cm longer won't matter, but make sure you can get roof racks that will manage the weight.
I'd advise reading up on your state's boating regs. You don't need a licence, but it won't hurt to know what is expected of other water users.
This forum (and others) have lots of info on safety. Being a good swimmer is a good start, but there is lots of other stuff to take into account also. The mere fact that you are aware of safety issues bodes well, I'm sure you'll be enjoying this awesome pastime, safely, very soon.


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## john316 (Jan 15, 2009)

Joel said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> My name is Joel and I am new to the forum. You can find my introduction thread here: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=54073
> 
> ...


Joel, in our house we have both paddle and pedal yaks. Mine is a an AI and the child bride glides around in a PA. I am currently waiting for a new hull after splitting the AI and have resorted to pinching the PA just to get out on the water. I miss my own set up which was tailored specifically around my style and her PA doesn't have some of the things that I consider to essential (after-market stuff like anchor trolleys, sounders etc) but I have been surprised by how easy it is to pedal and how fast it gets across the water. Some of the things I don't like about it have been fixed in the newer versions. Getting them on and off cars is a personal preference but one I avoid by using custom made trailer, home built from scratch. The one point you raised that I would say should tip you towards the PA. I have begun to fish with a fly rod and while I am getting more confident while standing I do find that casting from a sitting position, while possible, is more difficult from a seated position. The PA allows you to stand and fly cast which is a real plus but you will need to come up with a stripping basket that suits the PA as there are just too many things to tangle the line.

cheers

john


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Joel

I just love the passion! It IS an exciting sport. So ok, some background. First there are the peddal pushers (the Hobies), then there are the paddlers. Then there are the paddlers who want speed. Then there are the guys who feel a serious push in this direction needs a sea kayak, then last are the guys who want a fast sea kayak and hope to fish when there is a chance. This scale goes from Hobie-mania to paddle purist. I am on an extreme edge of this scale. :shock:

In the past I had decided not to comment on Hobies (topic gets a tad political) but recently we have had Hobies giving advice on paddle selection, so what the hey.

First, the PA is not a kayak. I would call it a battle cruiser. Star Wars style. But I'll settle for "fishing platform". I think actually a bloody good fishing platform. Personally I wouldn't use one in-shore, which is my main fishing zone. And definitely not in the surf. But in the estuaries and sweet water, damn effective fishing platform. But in narrow water, having never tested one, which I never will, I might want something easier to manouvre when you get hung up in the mangroves. Outback maybe.

Downsides are weight and transport, but you've worked that out.

But seriously, try something that paddles before making a call. Never know, you might like it.


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## Yak4ever (Nov 19, 2010)

Joel, your story sounds light mine 2 years ago, I only made up my mind when I took a couple out for a test. I went for the PA, there is a technique to loading these boats onto roof racks. I was shown by the Hobie crew when I got mine, not as hard as I expected it to be. Must admit like John above I to am considering a trailer which I want to rig for camping and easy carrying. I am loading onto a Kluger so it is quiet high but some times I use a CRV and yes the yak is long but not too long to go on your car. 
I love my PA, no problems standing and casting for Bara, even tested two fish around the meter mark at the same time and had no problems with stability.

But you must test run and find the one that makes you feel comfortable, you will end up spending alot of time it if you choose the right one.

Good luck!


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

Joel

A fishing yak is a big investment. A common statement by a newbie to any aspect of kayaking is, "I just want to paddle on lakes", or, "I'm sticking to the estuaries". These comments are often made with some awareness by the newbie of his 'novice' status, possibly tempered by wanting to ward off unwanted advice from experienced yakkers on more purpose built (and/or expensive) kayaks. _When you are new to something you often have little idea how much you don't know_.

There is a possibility here of the 'novice' trapping themselves into a limitation on craft type, a limitation that they may regret in the not too distant future, *especially if they (soon after purchase) increase their skills and knowledge*. They may then find themselves with a craft that limits them, rather than they themselves being the limiting factor as at their beginnings. Now I'm hearing you about fly fishing, and I guess more stable (PA) the better. But should you get more interested over time in estuaries or beyond, Outback, or Revo for offshore would be more suitable. For example, I have seen quite a few people buy a 'flat water' or 'estuary' kayak, and months later find it lacking as they now wish to venture 'outside'.

Just some things to weigh up, especially if budget is limited to one kayak. If you buy a PA and end up offshore in a Revo, the changeover could cost you a fair bit of money (but you won't be standing up in a Revo). Difficult decisions, and this example is Hobie only. There are many others (for example... I have 7 kayaks for sale viewtopic.php?f=6&t=53939 

My advice: 
* Get some test drives
* Think where you want to be (especially in 6 - 12 months)
* Buy a few gold lotto tickets
* Have a drink and think

Good luck

Trevor


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## john316 (Jan 15, 2009)

Joel said:


> john316 said:
> 
> 
> > john
> ...


Joel, you are going to get conflicting advice so sift through it and look for what YOU want... My comments are based on what suits me Dru's and Trev's will reflect different perspectives. Though varied all these answers are valid to the person who sent them. Dru is quite right in that even Hobie sell the PA as a boat just don't let on to someone like my lady... she loves hers to bits and I'm luck to be able to sneak it away once in a while. Check the launch sites around where you live, Trev (Kayakone) would probably have trouble trying to launch a PA through the surf, which is why so many of the guys up there use the skis. Down my way there are a lot of places where there is easy launching and easy access to the ocean and I see a lot of P.A.s when I'm outside on my AI.
From my experience the PA is very manoeuvrable and the seat is an armchair ride. I don't know how long it takes to get uncomfortable - I just know its longer than the time I have sat in one and if you did get saddle weary you can always stand up for a bit. I can't do that in my sit in...

cheers

John


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

john316 said:


> Joel, you are going to get conflicting advice so sift through it and look for what YOU want... My comments are based on what suits me Dru's and Trev's will reflect different perspectives.John


There it is. x2. The PA is an amazing piece of equipment. If it works for you... Enjoy.


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## john316 (Jan 15, 2009)

taking a step sideways... Dru, do you fish from the Zegul or do leave the fishing for the swing???

cheers

John


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

john316 said:


> taking a step sideways... Dru, do you fish from the Zegul or do leave the fishing for the swing???
> 
> cheers
> 
> John


PM sent and Comments added on the Xegul thread. But pretty much all my fishing is from the Zegul. Joel, this is a little off topic, but so it makes sense, the Zegul is about as close to "black" that you can get if the PA is "white".

As I said though, it all depends on what you are looking for. The PA gets you fishing without stink or engines, wonderful stability. One thing above everything else that Hobie deserve respect for - the ergonomics and detail design to suit the intended purpose are really fantastic.


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## greenfish (Apr 9, 2009)

Hey there Dru, I just had a quick flick thrue the thread you started and dont think I saw mention of the Native Watercraft Mariner or Ultimate Propel series of vessels - Certainly more cycle orientated than the Hobie as far as pedal motion goes - Cheaper than a PA by near $1000 - could be well worth looking at mate - and you get to go backwards any time your ready! Check them out on the web - Hope I havnt confused things for you...........................Alex


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## greenfish (Apr 9, 2009)

Sorry Dru last post was directed to Joel - to continue on - the Native Watercraft is a lot more compact than the PA - I have the Mariner 10 and I can stand up and fish no problem.
and it can be loaded on roof racks or in my case put in the back of a single-cab ute tray quite easily by one person - and off you go!
The PA is an awsome vessel - I have fished from one a few times and know a number of anglers who own them. Hobie has the best customer service on the market - the amount of hobie owners that I know that have had problems with their hulls that have been replaced by Hobie without any quarms is amazing!......................Greenfish
p.s its never going to be an easy choice


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

PA meets your brief. Perfectly I would have said.


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## swabio (Aug 16, 2010)

Having had the PA for a year now..... the only downside to it is the weight...... But having it trailer mounted now, that is less of an issue..... I reckon I will end up with a jet ski like trailer..... so I dont even have to take the wheels with me 

It is uber stable, and once offshore it is great... the surf zone on re-entry is not its best friend though


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## buttcrack (Jun 25, 2010)

I've had an Outback for a couple of years and it is a fantastic yak! The only issue I have is the weight and speed. Lifting 28kg over your head, twisting your torso and putting it on the ground to get it off the roof can't be good for your back and I'm a big guy! So you'll need to work out your system for getting your PA on and off your roof first.

My style of fishingh is trending to more offshore now and I'm now considering the Mirage Adventure Island as a yak with more speed and stability...

Have fun and let us know what you get!

Cheers,
Andrew


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## theGT58 (Nov 1, 2011)

G'Day Joel and welcome!

Whatever you end up with you will no doubt be happy just to get in on kayak fishing! Really great being out here on the water, bit of exercise and the adventure of hitting new fishing places really is great.

You've def made a step in the right direction going for some advice from this forum, the members i've found are really knowledgable and helpful. You are def right, there are many schools of thought on the ideal yak. The one overiding one is there prob is no such thing lol! I don't know if you will find the one that is going to suit everything/ every situation for you 100% but you find something that is pretty darn suitable given the range on the market. Great that you know your needs, this narrows it down alot for you.

So, off the bat: I think you're on the right track, PA, outback or a native watercraft are likely to be your best bet.

If you go for a PA I doubt you will like paddling it if the urge arises to get into it as you noted. From what i've heard anyway they are paddleable only really in an emergency and a bit of a barge to paddle otherwise. However sounds like paddling is really secondary to you so this may be a sacrifice you make due to the PA ticking the majority of your boxes.

Your primary interest is fishin, I wouldn't fully discount 'normal' yaks as not being as stable to fish from by a PA is almost certainly a better/more stable fishing platform. Seeing as how you want to fly fish as you seem to realise you need a fairly stable yak if you don't have very good balance. As noted by another though you will probably need some form of bucket to catch you stripped line though, there is ALOT of stuff to get tangled on in any yak.

A outback may be suitable if you find you can stand in one ok and are not fly fishing a majority of the time, can't comment too much on native watercraft as I don't have enough knowledge on how stable they may be to stand in. I would not discount them though given the apparent significant cost saving, more similar peddling to a cycle and as indicated by another they are quite stable and their promotional material at any rate claims they are stable to stand and cast from. Hopefully others can give better feedback on their actual stability though. As also noted by another it really seems like a PA is what you are after (if you can wear the cost, weight etc). The only real way to get a 100% idea is to test them all. Hobie should be able to arrange it pretty well, you will need to contact Native to get more info as they will be harder to test IMO.

Just a warning I will note as you said you want stability as a primary concern (and not wet your gear) that you should be aware when on the water in such a small craft (whichever it is) you are ineveitably going to get gear quite wet at some stage, even just from splash. You should also be aware that while alot more stable that people (while alot rarer) have still flipped PA's unexpectedly. As such whatever you get you will still need to prep for the water (thether or stow everything you dont want to lose, see the safety section too) with the idea you may get flipped out one day. It is a fact of small craft on the water.

I will note, not to put you off, but also that as you note you are potentially spending big not to forget (as I nearly did) that there are extra costs outside buying a kayak i.e roofracks, lifevest, potential loading equipment to get it on the racks, potential fishing gear to suit (landing nets etc), safety gear (first aid kit, yak suitable clothing etc etc). I spent easily the cost of my yak again ($1250ish) getting all the gear needed to get on the water and keep safe. It all adds up. Nothing I bought really I would consider to be non essential.


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## garyp (May 30, 2008)

The PA is great in the water but heavy and unwieldy out of the wet - especially at loading time.

Strongly suggest you consider getting a trailer with it. I fought that battle for a year and finally got a trailer. Now I find it very easy to load / unload and go fishing.

Good luch


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## MY03VY (Mar 17, 2012)

Josh,

I am in a very similar position to you.

As much as I love the PA, and it ticks 90% of the boxes, the weight and money are two big components that have steered me away from it. I'll be loading onto the roof of a Commodore, and having picked up a PA at Sunstate Hobie, I have crossed it off my list.

I am now leaning more towards either an Outback or a Revo.

As mentioned earlier, you will need to allow money in whatever budget you buy for fitting the yak out too.

I have actually set up an Excel file with all the pricing of parts and accessories from Hobie (and sounders from external suppliers). I have 3 tabs set up too which allow for Quest 11/13, Revo/Outback, and Pro Angler. It gives you all the common stuff you'd fit out and pricing, and then pricing for roof racks as well. I don't have stuff like life vests or first aid kits, but these can be added into the budget from suppliers like BLA or BCF. (A good example is rod leashes, the Hobie ones are $19.90 each, whereas Eco brand ones from BCF are $4.95... doesn't take a rocket scientist to work that one out.)

I am happy to email you the file if you like. I found it great with the calculations, you simply enter the quantity of each item you want then it gives you a final (scary) figure at the end.

Unlike you, I do plan on doing some partially smooth water fishing (Hervey Bay, Moreton Bay).

Another thing to note, is keep an eye on the Hobie america website, as there are rumours circling that tomorrow (16/4/12) there is going to be a 12' version of the PA announced. That may very well suit you a little better, and is certainly something I'm keeping my eyes peeled for.

Shoot me an email at [email protected] if you would like me to send you that excel file.

Regards,

Rob


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## feelfree09 (May 5, 2009)

joel, i reckon the only way you will decide between an outback and a PA is to test run both. if you wanna do a lot of stand up fishing then i reckon a PA would be the better bet. ive owned 2 and i wouldnt hesitate to get another. the weight of the PA is its biggest enemy but if you get a trailer for it youre gonna be sweet as. also as has been mentioned check out youre local launch spots and see what capabilities you need. ive taken my PA upto 3km offshore and had no issue. ive also been 500m off the beach in 25 knot winds and not really had a problem either. it wasnt actually comfortable but was never dangerous. as for the seat comfort, ive spent 8 hrs+ out on the water and was perfectly comfortable.
im a huge fan of the PA as you can probably tell, but im well aware theyre not for everyone. goodluck with your choice


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## spork (Jan 21, 2012)

Hey mate, have you bought yet?
If you haven't, check out the "new", 11" PA that should be available in a couple of months.


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Joel said:


> I am now looking at the Pro Angler 12. It appears to be what I want. Guess I will have to wait until it is released in Australia. Is it recommended that I wait until a few others have purchased and/or reviewed them in Australia? Or do Hobie generally have well tested yaks that function perfectly on release?
> 
> Joel


Let's give Hobie there due. There boats are well designed and well considered. Any issues (there have been few) are well supported and corrected. Your call then, but it's really only whether you need to wet test first. You can have faith in Hobie.


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Joel said:


> Thanks Dru.
> 
> To clarify, I wasn't accusing Hobie of that. I was just asking as I am new to the forum and still haven't even peddled a yak yet. I don't know what companies have god or bad reputations, but from what I have read, Hobie up there with the good.
> 
> Joel


Get hold of Hobie, tell them what you are thinking, go for a peddal. They'll look after you.


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## john316 (Jan 15, 2009)

Joel said:


> So,
> 
> I finally tested some out! I walked into the dealership expecting to confirm that the revolution 13 was right for me as I had previously decided that I would happily sacrifice ability to stand for the opening up of more fishing situations i.e. offshore.
> However, after trying the Revolution 13 and the Outback, I actually feel a lot more comfortable in the Outback. I thought the difference in speed would be far more significant than it was. I also though, for some unknown reason, that the revo was cheaper. I was wrong there too. Unless I change my mind again (definitely possible) I will go with the Outback.
> ...


Joel, the paddle pedal sail guys are top blokes...

since you started this thread way back we have had a change of floaties and no longer have the PA. I have been in the same AI since forever and the child bride is now up to hobie no. 3 which is a 13ft revo. The outback is blunter wider and has a bigger storage but because we wanted the ability to paddle we went with the revo - different brief to yours.

reading back through the thread you made a comment that you didn't want to fly cast sitting down... I did some casting lessons and asked the instructor if he had taught anyone to cast from a sitting position and he replied that he had been asked to instruct a couple of "disabled" people but that standing was easier. I had to explain that it was not for a disability but for casting from a kayak :lol: he politely declined but I have persisted and even though it took some getting used to I am able to cast from the adventure even if it is not casting the full line. the major concern is to make sure your casts are at an upwards angle to keep them off the water till you want it there.

as for the other things... do some searches on the forum as you will find oodles of info on how different people have made pulley systems/racks etc and a variety of methods for loading or trailering the yaks. I'm an old bloke by your standards and I personally don't have any trouble loading the smaller yaks without rack and roll or hullevators etc but by for ease and safety have been using trailers for a few years now. still use the roof racks sometimes though...

have fun when you make the purchase

John


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## Rstanek (Nov 5, 2007)

Was good to meet you yesterday Joel! Casting while seated really isn't too much of an issue once you get used to it, just keep your rod tip nice and high. Working out an effective line management system is probably the most important thing. Fishing from the yak I rarely have to make casts more than 60ft, just put the hours in down at the park and you'll get it.


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## neale (Sep 2, 2010)

Hello Joel,
I have a PA 12 and it's easy to pedal for say, a 10 km day.
You can't paddle it, well you could but it wont be as enjoyable as say an Adventure, I have one of these as well.
It's hard to beat as a fishing platform and IMHO, it has the best seat for a yak available anywhere.
So yeah, 10 km days, wont paddle well, ultra stable, ultra comfortable to fish out of.


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