# Heavy Tackle Fishing - what was learnt at SWR.



## beefs (Jan 30, 2006)

It sounds like a lot of people benfitted from the avid heavy tackle kayak fisherman who shared their knowledge around at South West Rocks. Wondering if people could post up the tips and tricks they picked up for those of us not so fortunate as to be there!? 

Eg - Knots for heavier line in general and knots for connecting leaders. Livebait rigging and trolling tips. Hook selection, trolling techniques etc


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## Astro (Nov 27, 2006)

i'll be following this as well......


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## grant ashwell (Apr 24, 2007)

Perhaps I can start with a few observations. I noted that several people were using quite heavy gauge hooks. These might be good for Kingfish ( I don't know) however, would take a fair bit of driving home. Perhaps those that are returning next year might like to check out Gamakatsu SL 12 hooks. This is the model the legendary Paulo used. Size 6/0 up. Circle hooks in lighter gauges also. Heavy hooks and leaders probably tire the swimming bait

Paul did the job with 15 kilo line. Certainly 80-150lb leaders don't wear through but they also cost bites. Strike a happy medium. There are a lot of boats out there--what gives YOU the edge?

Gaffs- make your own so that you know it will do the job or purchase a quality model. Only needs to be short but a Marlin or twisting Cobia will destroy cheap alloy and wooden jobs.

A sounder makes a big difference in finding bait schools (and accompanying target fish)

Bimini double to ( my brain is frozen but I put the mono through the loop, twist around the braid double 7 times then back out the loop) for the trace. Palomar for the hook. Retie hooks every night and after good fish.

Dont use rubber band bridles that are too far off the front of the bait ie use shorter bands which end up about 1cm off the bait. Use zip ties if it's easier.

Some bait needles were huge-totally traumatize the fish

Tie everything down before going out and if it can be done (whatever it is) before launching then do it. Much easier on land that at sea.

Live baits of a size suitable for the target species ie not too big unless after sharks or cobia

3l of drinking water for a morning. Good hat and sun protection

If there is a lot of traffic, sometimes better to fish deeper

Slow troll ( 1 km p/hour) esp around bait schools.

Don't be afraid to ask, read and experiment. We all do it differently and the challenge is to stay ahead of the pack.


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## Nodds (Feb 28, 2007)

Grant you just made more scents and gave me a much clearer picture of what to do as a starting point for someone who has never fished big before than I've gotten from the last 20 or so articles I've read.
Thank you very much  

Beefs I'm glad you posted this topic and I hope you get into some good fishing on Friday (if I had a car I'd be there with you)
Like Astro said I'll be watching this thread closely.

cheers nodds


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## feel the sting (Aug 8, 2006)

I didn't fish the SWR convention. But just concerning hook selection. If you are fishing with livies for marlin, and want to keep the marlin and shorten fight time, I'd go with a J hook and let the marlin swallow the bait deep and try and get a gill hookup which really hurts them. For catch and release the best hooks are circles as you usually get a jaw hookup, but probably alot longer fight time.

the sting


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## Davey G (Jan 15, 2006)

I've never gone out specifically targeting fish that are bigger and heavier than me, so I was also on a bit of a learning curve. My lessons learnt..

1. Getting live bait is sometimes not easy. Despite seeing plenty of bait on the sounder (and schools of yakkas/slimeys free swimming under the yak) I had trouble catching the little bastards.

2. Sabiki Bait jigs are a fricken pain in the butt. They might catch livebait but boy, do they catch everything else too (seat, pfd, gloves, legs, fingers, hats). aaaarrrrggghhhhhhhhh. I had mine rigged on a handline the first couple of days, then switched to a rod but the sabiki got totally tangled when I used the rod. Next time I might shorten it a bit (make it 4 droppers instead of 6) as this would be easier to manage.

3. Did I mention livebait were hard to catch?

4. Bigger livebaits tend to swim in erratic directions. Do not,,,,repeat do not stop paddling while you have 2 livebaits out otherwise they will do their best to tangle both lines into the worlds largest ball of braid.. 

5. Livebaits survive very well by nose hooking them. I towed a slimey around for a couple of hours and then changed over to a yakka. Both were still frisky after a few hours when i thought they'd cark it after 15 minutes.. This means that I don't need to gather 20 livies - 3 or 4 will probably do the job for a mornings fishing

6. My knots (when using 50lb mono leader) sucked. I normally tie an albright knot (the one Grant Ashwell was talking about above) from the braid to mono leader, but had several knots fail me due to the thicker line. Not sure what was goiong on but may need to look at a uni-uni connection when using heavier leaders.

7. I used 8/0 - 10/0 sized J hooks (Mustad Big Game) and found that they were fine for slimeys and yakkas. Although they didnt catch anything...... 

8. Carry a radio or mobile phone and go with someone else who also has one. Its so easy to get lost/seperated on the ocean and if you get into trouble then it would be graet to be able to contact someone.

9. Spend a morning surfing your kayak with no gear on board. This gives you a huge amount of knowledge about what the waves are going to feel like when surfing in/paddling out. Its also a hell of a lot of fun!

I'm sure theres plenty of other tips but I can't think of any more at the moment


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## grant ashwell (Apr 24, 2007)

The knot I now use from the gel spun Bimini to mono is the Bristol
Re the sabikis- try cutting them in half ie make two lots of 3 hook jigs. Just remember to connect them the right way up. A heavier than ususal weight when jigging helps.


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## DGax65 (Jun 7, 2006)

If you are having trouble making live bait, it sometimes helps to put Gulp or little squid/fishy bits on the hooks. To get the bait interested you can poke a few holes in a can of cat food and tie it off to the yak. This makes a nice oily, aromatic burley trail. Use only 3 or 4 hooks on the sibiki. If you are targeting mackerel, you don't want more than a couple of those on the sibiki at one time.

Sibiki rigs are a pain in the butt. They will snag just about everything on your kayak. I pity the foo who gets his sibiki hooked into the bow carry handle. Been there-done that. After you have made bait you probably want to put the sibiki away so you don't snag anything. Trying to get a sibiki back onto those little cardboard things is nearly impossible. The solution: use a pool noodle or something similar onto which you wrap the sibiki.










I was all out of noodles so I used a piece of Tygon tube wrapped with some foam pipe insulation. The pool noodles work much better, but this worked in a pinch. Start at one end and start wrapping the main line. As you get to each hook, just stick it into the foam. You get fewer tangles and it is much quicker to rig again.

Ahi USA makes rod specifically for sibiki fishing. 
Ahi Sibiki Stick 
The rod is hollow and the sibiki winds back inside. Some people like them; other don't. The rod is very stiff and you don't get a very good action on the sibiki. I just don't like taking a single-purpose rod when I'm kayak fishing. I take one light rod that doubles as a bait rod and a bass rod. I've seen people make similar sibiki rods from an old cut-down rod with a PVC pipe attached. You just have to cut a slot in the near end of the pipe for the line to wind through.

BTW: Whatever you think this Sibiki holder looks like....it isn't. Get your mind out of the gutter and just let it go :lol:


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## sbd (Aug 18, 2006)

I bought a sabiki rod, but gave it to Gary for use on the boat - a PITA on the yak for sure. I now use my sabikis as disposable ($5.50 a throw for my preferred model) and have found it much less hassle, as long as you don't get them out 'til you need them. I run it off the lightest rod I carry, and have become fairly practiced at only snagging everything most of the time. I like (home) salted pilchard fillets as bait for the sabiki, hard enough to stay on the hooks and much more attractive as bait than squid or gulp. Sabikis on a handline are more trouble than they're worth.


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## Astro (Nov 27, 2006)

this is not a bait jig thread.....we want to know how to catch big fish..... :roll:

paulo did well on a sp and thats what i will be using mainly for trolling or whatever works.....

i have a shimano charter special that is my light game reel that will be teamed up with braid line was thinking 50lb..

looking to set up a rig for trolling behind an AI....so any recommendations would be good........for slow to fast speeds

whitsundays.......pelagics etc....


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## grant ashwell (Apr 24, 2007)

I'll go a bit further with this thread then Astro. I still believe that live bait from a yak is preferable to soft plastic however, one has to factor in time available because making bait can eat into fishing time. This is assuming your target is a large pelagic
For trolling, around and around mid to top bait schools is a good starting place thus put a handful of baits in storage (how you keep them alive is a mission in its self) then drop the next one or 2 over where you are and if deep (for me 15mtrs plus) sit for a while cause old cobia might be down there then move off at 1-1.5 k per hour.
If the bait is a bit flat, trim a little of its tail fin off cause that fires it up. I prefer to hold my line feeling the bait wriggle when threatened. When it pings off out of my fingers, I let the fish take maybe 3 seconds or more of free line before engaging and letting the fish run into the hook. 50k gelspun is fine but you need a trace with a good connection (bimini/bristol) I topshot with 50m of mono which I replace as needed. This provides ample shock absorbtion.
A good starting read is Bluewater Fishing by Julie and Lawrie McEnally from SWR. $29.95. Peter Goadby gamefishing books from your local library are more advanced.
It is worth learning to read sounder pictures too-helps with identifying probable types of bait and those under threat. There are threads on other fishing sites that have some detail.
I have experimented with many different types of rods-and broken some expensive models. I like shorter versions-more leverage and less tiring. I use mid price jig rods for overhead and threadline. I would rather have a good reel on a cheap rod than the other way around. If you cannot afford SIC guides then dipping the top guides in the water to cool them off might help if line is being continually taken.
Other ideas incl what the locals are catching, water temp, reading bird activity, regular reading of other fishing sites to pick up trailer boatie ideas-Ausfish and Fishnet are a couple. For weather I use Buoy weather and seabreeze but we all have our favourites.
Once you start you will soon develop a style that suits you-but always be open to new ideas and techniques.


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## paulo (Nov 1, 2007)

I suppose I should be offering some advice but the novice that I am, I am still asking. I saw quite a few boaties down there using a lump of polystyrene on their leader. I can only asume that they wrap the line around the foam with the appropriate length of leader on the other side to keep the livey above a certain depth in the water column. Fish strikes and the leader cuts through the foam and voila.
Have I got it right? 
Is this a replacement for a baloon?
I assume the foam gets crunched and ends up floating around the sea? That part is probably not so good if true.

On knots, line and leader.
I got away with single stranded braid with a double uni to the 100lb leader. I shouldnt have and would have tied a double in the braid if I had taken the time to learn. Thinking about the nose wrap on the marlin, the hook had little bearing and probabaly meant most of the force was centred around the knot.
I would agree lighter is better. It shows that with the right knots and settings on everything the heavy line isnt that critical. I have personally never used over 30lb braid. Whether casting slugs for tailor and the likes from the beach or hauling in 30+kg cobia outwide I have never had the braid break once. One thing I learnt last week is to have a min 20m leader, longer if you can afford it.


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## Physhopath (Jun 21, 2007)

I have heard the problems with balloons is when they break off or even when they deflate, they can look like jellyfish.
Reported that turtles and the like eat the balloons and it is not so good for them.  
When I was fishing Barry's Bay ( Point Plomer south of SWR )we used foam to stop the slimeys hiding down in the reefs.
You could actually see your piece of foam "panic / get all twitchy etc." Before the take. 8) 
The foam as far as I know is less harmfull on the other critters in the water. :?


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## crazyratwoman (Feb 26, 2007)

Astro said:


> this is not a bait jig thread.....we want to know how to catch big fish..... :roll:
> 
> ..


i had no idea what a sabiki thingy was and have never caught live bait yet to even catch a big fish as in what everyone was chasing at SWR so thanks heaps for the info DGax, altho i could see myself hooking the front handle, the anchor trolley, the anchor, the bag behind me, myself and not getting any bait! :lol:


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## simond11 (Aug 29, 2005)

The Sabiki jigs are very very popular in SE Asia. In Singapore they throw them at you, they are so cheap. Some of them have large hooks, and I presume they are to catch small frigate mackerel and small bonito. The better ones are the Japanese made ones, but they are usually a couple of $$ more expensive. 
Although they tell you you can fish them with no bait, I have yet to catch any fish without bait.
Yes, I know...It's not a Sabiki thread...sorry 
So...what was learnt at SWR??
Cheers

Simon
Prowler 15


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## Physhopath (Jun 21, 2007)

I learn't to take more water than you think.
Take more food than you think.

I had enough water for the day, Did not think I was going to paddle as far as I did !!
I had my picnic ( chocolate bar ) about 30 mins before Paulo's hook up.

Lesson learn't take some sort of Muesli / breakfast bar/ choccie bar/ ARMY RATION / more food than you think !!! :shock:

Water goes without saying but if I had 2.0 ltrs of Solo or a similar drink it would have been very helpful on the day.

I was out there for a long time and ate heartily when I returned, BUT I WAS NOT PREPARED TO BE OUT THERE THAT LONG !!

I was prepared to paddle home when I had had enough !

SO pack for contingencies, If it is your day !!! you want to have enough energy etc to land your fish.

I know for certain I will have a sports/ electrolite drink on board, and breakfast bars, muesli bars.

I was starving when I got back and nailed a "Big breakfast all you can eat 2.5kg tin " lol

How Paulo did it I just Don't Know :shock: :shock:

Just shows his dedication 8) 8) 8)


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## fisherdan (Apr 17, 2007)

I had more than I need as usual though the one thing that probably cost me a good fish was that I was using 100lb and 120lb (Black magic supple) leader which Grant was very helpful in pointing out would probably tire the live bait to early and not give them the freedom to swim naturally, as well as sticking out like, well 120lb leader... I pre-make and pack several Hook leader swivel rigs and keep them handy though in future I will have a range of weight line and hook combo's from say 30lb with appropriate hook up to the overkill 120lb with size 10 live bait hooks...

Lately I have been trying to force myself to stick with a setup until it works though I may just go back to mixing it up a bit to get a bite! Then if I bust off go a little heavier..

I will also heavy test my new Gaff's especially before handing it to Grant to attack a Marlin with    Well what was I to expect from a $5 bargain :roll:

Always learning... Still having a great time


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## keza (Mar 6, 2007)

on the food side of things i take food bars, not just the snack type but the full nutritional type.
I also take energy gels incase i need them and it helps to put some stuff in your water to help you hydrate.
All these things are available from a cycling shop and probably other endurance sports shops.
I usually only carry 1.5lt of water, have a drink before i go and add stuff to the water to help me absorb it if it is a long paddle.

Tackle: for what it is worth i use 30lb braid and 50lb flouro leader. doubled with a bimini to a double uni.
I was using a 7/0 hook straight to the leader but when we saw it next to Dans heavy outfit he gave me one of his out of sympathy.


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