# Closure of Moreton Bay to ALL fishing



## HiRAEdd (Nov 12, 2005)

Well, it hasn't happened yet, but it's on the cards.
This info came from http://reports.fishingmonthly.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=487



> MORE CLOSURES!
> On a very serious note, the boffins at the Australian Marine Conservation Society have put in an application to have a large portion of Moreton Bay and surrounding areas closed to recreational fishing. These include all the water between Cape Moreton, Flinders Reef and Hutchinson Shoals plus a minimum 1.5km curtain around the entirety of Moreton Island. This will put bay locations such as Tangalooma Wrecks, Curtain Artificial, Sand Hills, Cowan Ledge, Bulwer Ledge, Benowa Track Reef, Comboyuro Point, most of Western Rocks, Yellowpatch, Cape Moreton, all Moreton Island beaches, Hutchies, Flinders etc etc out of bounds to recreational angling.
> 
> If you want to have a look at the map then go to their website http://www.amcs.org.au and scroll down the opening page to the icon with Moreton Bay Marine Park. Click on this and then scroll down to the map. The map is very small and hard to read as the sneaky bastards are doing their best to keep this information from the general public and to just push this item through parliament as a last minute agenda (as was done with the grey nurse shark closures) without the public even being informed about it. The potential closure areas are in sky blue colouration.
> ...


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## hairymick (Oct 18, 2005)

Hi Gavin,

I read your post this afternoon at work and was way too mad to respond. Do these scum understand that the bay has been systematticlly raped by otter trawlers since the 1960s - thousands of them.

When they bay was first opened up to otter trawlers in about 1963, the boats came from far and wide, including NSW every school prawn season and dragged the guts out of it. Every fish and marine animal they brought on board was killed in the catching.

I think the southern boats have gone now, but the resident trawling fleet is huge and the by-catch as they call it must be in the hundreds of thousands of tonnes every year. This by-catch also inclued a very big proportion of juvenile fish. These are facts. The ratio of by catch killed to prawns caught averages between 3 to 8 baskets of by-catch to every basket of prawns.

How can they blame the recreational fisherman for the decline in fish stocks? I can understand and would support a move to restict the activities of the commercial sector and a more stringent bag limit on recreational fishing, but to seek to lock up somewhere like Moreton Bay makes me think that these people are actively seeking a confrontation in order to gain some publicity.

All recreational fishermen (and women) need to get together on this and fight this proposal tooth an nail. If this lot of feral, hippy,vego, wanker, greenie parasites get there way here, where is next on their hit list. How bloody dare this handful of psuedo intellectuals attempt to impose their set of values on the millions of recreational anglers here most of whome, by the way, do no harm and only take what they need.


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## HiRAEdd (Nov 12, 2005)

I had this discussion with a person in the dive industry (incidently he is also a recreational fisherman too). His opinion was that recreational fisherman do more damage and he backed up his statements with quotes from the Environmental Protection Agency. The results of their studies apparently showed that when you take into account boat pollution, anchoring, fishing, littering, etc., etc., recreational fishing caused a greater impact than commercial fishing.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. A commercial fishing boat takes more in one sweep of it's nets than I will in my entire life. Even taking into account the vastly greater number of recreational fishers compared to commercial fishermen, rec fishers will never come close to the volume taken by commercial fishing.
I think there is a place for commercial fishing but right now, I don't believe for a second that it is being done sustainably. I also don't think that external environmental factors are being considered. All the blame is being dropped on fisherpeople, recreational and commercial alike.
I for one will be approaching my local politicians regarding this matter and I encourage _everyone_, everywhere to approach their local politicians and make it known they will not be voting for anyone that entertains rediculous ideas such as that put forth by Australian Marine Conservation Society.


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2006)

Good points Gav and Mick.
If we don't get up and stand up as reccie anglers we're all gonna be screwed. Conservation groups are armed with the skills to dig out political loopholes and exercise them. They have the power to create an environmental emergency out of a drop of seawater. This is why reccie anglers are forced to be Re-Active and not Pro-Active.

If the environmental groups, government and reccie anglers groups focussed all thier strategic energies on coexistence and education, Australians would be much better off. It's a much better solution to head to head battles like the ones we face on a daily basis.


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## Dodge (Oct 12, 2005)

The situation pointed to by Gavin is one of the reasons all rec anglers should actively support The Fishing Party who are quietly gathering strength to fight on our behalf.

See the article on page 9, of Modern Fishing July 2005 which gives some insight


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## HiRAEdd (Nov 12, 2005)

An update on this situation.



> Firstly, this week I must make some apologies for second-hand information, which I gave out last week. I had passed on this information from someone who should have been fed the correct details but unfortunately there was a bit of a mix up somewhere along the line. The map I referred to on the AMCS website is in fact the current Marine Park Zoning areas and not the new proposed closure areas. The new proposed areas have been hard to find out exactly as the AMCS are apparently trying to keep it under their hats for as long as possible, as was done with the grey-nurse shark closure debacle. The details were cleared up somewhat today after I spoke with Shane Boese, who is the chairman for The Fishing Party in Southern Queensland. He informs me that the proposed areas for a total fishing ban will be 1km from every island in the bay ie Mud, Green, Peel, St.Helena and Moreton as well as several other areas to make up a total 50% area closure to all fishing in Moreton Bay. This scenario is probably even worse than I outlined last week, especially for the owners of boats under 5m who donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t venture much further than this. As soon as we can get anything more solid than this in writing, I will relay the information as we need to jump on this one as soon as possible. Once again, I apologise for the mix up.


As he says, this scenario is even worse for owners of small boats (which obviously all of us come under). Once again, I would urge everyone, everywhere to contact their local member and express their displeasure for any political party that would support this or any similar legislation.


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## Phoenix (Jan 12, 2006)

Good recreational fishermen provide many things;
* An information source on polution & illegal fishing
* An in-promptu rescue service
* A rubbish collecting service

This is often forgotten by pollies and greenies. Without fisho's the world would be a much worse place.

Bad recreational fishermen provide many things;
* Many catch & keep under-sized fish
* Many through rubbish such as bait bags, tackle & 
* Polution through poorly maintained boats
* Take up coast guard and VMR time in rescues 
* Don't take or know how to use safety gear.

These idots give good guys a bad name. There are very real moves to ban recreational fishing in Victoria by some green group - forgot their name, but saw them on chan 9 recently.

It is a shame - but some fishos are a true discrace. As fisho's we need to clean up our act, perhaps adopt some "radical" ideas such as they have in the US or South Africia to lift the game.

I would personally endorse;
* Essential club membership. Ie A fisho must belong to a fishing club
* An annual fishing license. As long as the money funded a full time US style, coast guard. Which should help decrease piracy & illegal fishing.

Just my thoughts

Phoenix


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## Peril (Sep 5, 2005)

In NSW we pay an annual licence. There is high non-compliance and still many bad fishos of the type you describe. While fisheries is putting in some compliance effort and checking boats, they just don't have enough resources to make it hard for the idiots.

Most of the rec licence fee goes to buy out fishing licences when a waterway is declared a recreational fishing haven, RFH (no commercial operations). Unfortunately, even this is rorted as the government did not first cancel disused licences so many operators are taking the money and reactivating dormant licences.

We have to fight hard against recreational fishing closures. There is no evidence that recreational fishing is having a negative effect on fish stocks. The recovery of fish stocks in RFHs in Botany Bay and Lake Macquarie is solid evidence to the contrary. If there is genuine evidence that a particular technique is taking a threatened species in a given area, the some restriction might be supportable (eg restrict hook and bait sizes in a given area), but noone is putting up that evidence.

Have a look at Eco Fishers. Lets keep fighting these unwarranted closures. Mass civil disobedience is an option here. Apparently, from the beiginning of April, when hte Cape Byron closures come into effect, all competition anglers weighing in fish will state that there fish have come from a marine sanctuary. All power to them. I hope someone is starting a fund to help share the fines around.[/url]


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## Guest (Mar 1, 2006)

The licence is bad enough and itÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not helping with the Marin Parks. Club membership is just too much IMO. Why is it that minorities get to push us into taking such action? :evil:

My sons are going to grow up in a glass bubble. Not being able to experience challenges or push their personal boundaries. If by chance they are able to do something slightly risky it will be in a controlled situation where they will have to fill out a frigin form or some such nonsense. In other words they wont bother. 

They canÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t ride a dirt bike unless they are in a club or on private land if youÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re lucky enough to have access to it. We are having our local State Forest closing many of its roads to 4x4, cant take them shooting, canÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t have a fire on the local beach, cant camp hear cant camp there, cant climb that tree, cant jump off that rock, cant do this cant do that.. Do you have a permit do you have a licence, have you paid, do you have a bloody life? :evil: :evil:

As soon as one person gets hurt or killed thatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s seems to be an excuse to bring a new law or regulation to stop it for everybody. IMO boys need to be able to push their personal boundaries to grow into men. I accept that sometimes this results in them getting hurt or killed. Better this way than with a needle in their arm. Hey I still need to be able to push mine boundaries occasionally to feel like IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m alive. I still enjoy rock climbing.

When all the young people turn to drugs and or get them selves killed in car we will have the same do gooders going on about how itÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s all the parentÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s fault. :evil:

IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m not voting for either of the major parties any longer. The greens and all the other conservatives can also go jump.

Sorry about this rant IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m just upset about how I see this country going


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## Yakabe (Dec 16, 2005)

You know I read everyone's posts and this is the question I have to ask!!!

If we lowly (and maybe I speak for myself) kayak fisherman can see the problems, and can come up with reasonable solutions, why can't those swinging the big stick?

You know what would be nice, if HPV's where given there own classification (and maybe they do) when it comes time to making policy. As stated in this forum on too numerous occasions, our impact on the marine environment is negligible.

Yakabe.


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## Peril (Sep 5, 2005)

The big problem is there a several groups of quasi-religious cranks (including PETA, Wilderness Society, National Parks Association, Nature Conservation Council) who believe that without immediate human presence, all of the Earth's creatures live in ideal conditions, never troubled by their environment or each other. Therefore it is necessary to create as many human free areas as possible for the karma of those agitating for the areas and to put the planet in the most ideal, dare one say, divine state possible.

This is of course tosh (I'm trying to keep it nice) and one has to be a nutter to believe it.

The problem is that these zealots are politically active and Labor governments have always believed that they are the natural recipient of preferences from the political parties for which these nutters vote. Thus the state Labor governments will actively court these groups and seek to implement those parts of their agenda that cause the least amount of pain in the broad community. Marine sanctuaries is one of these.

The only way to counter this is to demonstrate to said Labor governments that they have miscalculated. That they are causing sufficient numbers of people pain to have them change their vote and negate or overwhelm any benefit they get from acquiescing to the nutters. Such demonstrations come from letters to politicians and to newspapers, attendance at public meetings, support and voting for fisher friendly candidates and civil disobedience (ignore the sanctuaries).

It really is of little importance to try divide recreational fishers between land-based, HPVs and stink boaters. We are all being effected by these pointless closures so we have all to stand together to fight them. Certainly those of us using HPVs should be raucous about this and try to get representation on the advisory boards set up by various government authorities but we should not lose sight of the fact the all fishers are affected so we have a common fight.

Arguments about fact and science seem to be irrelevant in this debate. It is about religion and politics. One can draw a parallel with the recent RU486 legislation in Federal Parliament. This was about legislation introduced to buy the vote of a religious zealot to obtain a political end (sale of Telstra). It took a cross party alliance of women who saw the injustice in this to agitate and eventually undo the legislation. We need to find those members in our state parliaments who see the injustice in these marine sanctuaries and are prepared to seek out their fellows and act. Warren Entsch in the Federal Parliament (QLD, Liberal, Leichhardt) has stood up on this issue so there is a chance that their are others out there in the state parliaments, which cover coastal waters out to 3km.


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## Phoenix (Jan 12, 2006)

Maybe we should take some of the state members of parliment to a paddle in our kayaks.....


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## Guest (Mar 2, 2006)

Yeah they can go out with Peril on his next surf launch :twisted:

Politicians arenÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t worth the trouble. I have no faith or trust in any of them. They donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t care what right just whatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s in it for them be it votes or money :evil:


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## hairymick (Oct 18, 2005)

Hey Guest, Thank you for contributing to our forum. Why don't you join up? You would be welcome here. 

By the way, I agree with all of the points you raised.


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## Guest (Mar 2, 2006)

Hariry One it's Rawprawn ranting. I'm unsure why my name is coming up as guest on these posts.


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## Guest (Mar 2, 2006)

Hey it's still appearing as guest. WhatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s going on? Help me I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t have an identity I feel all empty inside.

Wonder why it's only happening on the Marine Park Politics section?

Rawprawn: I only travel incognito during political and religious discussions


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## Peril (Sep 5, 2005)

Regardless what one thinks of pollies and their motivations, they create the sanctuaries and they are the only ones that can undo them. Never put your faith in them but we have no choice but to lobby them and get them to see sense and numbers.

Greg, have you tried loggin in 8)


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## rawprawn (Aug 31, 2005)

Peril said:


> Greg, have you tried loggin in 8)


Dohhh!!! I didnt think you could post if not logged in.

Rawprawn: I used to eat a lot of natural foods until I learned that most people die of natural causes


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## Guest (Apr 6, 2006)

It seems you can


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## Guest (Apr 6, 2006)

But for some reason only on this topic.

Oh well, if I get logged on as a guest occasionally it will take me longer to reach the embarrassing "veteran" status.


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## hairymick (Oct 18, 2005)

Q. What have you got if you have a greenie buried up to his/her/its neck in sand.

A. Not enough sand.


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## Phoenix (Jan 12, 2006)

Surely greater scruiteny of the commercial fishing industry is what is required. Someone said to me once that they worked on a trawler and saw entire schools of mackeral scooped up (I'm talking ones about 5cm long) probably spanish, all were destroyed.

Illegial fisherman & pirates are next on my list - our gov, in reality does sweet FA about them. The few we catch are put up at hotels & drink beer at Australian tax payers expese.

These idiots at AMCS want to encourage Indo fishermen into our waters :evil: :evil:

We need politicians with backbone.

I'd pay an annual fishing licence if it paid for a professional (US style) Coast Guard which actually had real authority and power, and a scientific arm which conducted genuine reasearch.

Not some greenie organisation who bribes scientists to say what they want.


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## Phoenix (Jan 12, 2006)

There is a very real question that springs to mind.

Is this policy even necessary, I ask that because in a few years petrol prices will be so expensive ($3.00) a litre??? that many rec fisho's simply wont be able to afford to go out in boats.


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## HiRAEdd (Nov 12, 2005)

But we kayakers will be


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## Phoenix (Jan 12, 2006)

Exactly - and all this great exercise from paddeling & fresh air to combat the obesity crisis. Not to mention nice fresh fish.


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## Blaen (Jul 4, 2006)

Phoenix said:


> There is a very real question that springs to mind.
> 
> Is this policy even necessary, I ask that because in a few years petrol prices will be so expensive ($3.00) a litre??? that many rec fisho's simply wont be able to afford to go out in boats.


Phoenix,

That is a quite a valid question, people down here are starting to think that way already, there is currently a resurgence in the "Coota" boats of old. Yep the latest craze slowly building up a following in Tassie is getting hold of the old sail powered couta boats for fishing from.

We once saw many hundreds of these great little craft on the waters down here and we may see it yet again. Whether it be by Yak or Sail you can't stop a dedicated fisherman, except by locking off their fishing spots :roll:


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## Dodge (Oct 12, 2005)

With a Queensland state election notified, the premier today said the Moreton Bay green closures are not on, and the GC ship terminal is also gone.

The Lib/Nats are also of the same opinion re the GC terminal, but no mention of the MB zones.

Can't beat an election to make them all fishermen think alikes :lol:


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## Crayman (Oct 10, 2006)

Well i normally don't look at this section on the site but i am glad i did.
I have spent many a year fishing Moreton Bay and the surrounds and i have alot of friends that make thier living from the bay and the tourist atracttions of Moreton /Straddie etc. Do these drone's realise how much damage they will do to not only peolpes hobbies and interests but to the families and economy of the local area. There are already charater operators gone broke over the closure of certian area's off-shore. I know of at least 30 people that would sell thier boats/yaks etc and be forced to take up gardening or knitting (not that they aren't nice hobbies) but be realistic who is going to by a Boat of any sort if they can't catch afeed at there door step. The local government has enough problems with young kids and thier behaviour so lets take away another interest that keeps them from sitting around getting bored( turning into little rascals). I worked as a security guard in the Redlands for a while and trust me the kids down there need things to keep them active. Who is going to travel to Moreton or Straddie if you can't wet a line. 
To finish they have no idea sitting in an air con office trying to justify a pay packet. :evil: :evil:


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## JB (Jul 5, 2006)

Team there is hope, Here in NZ our Kahawai (Aussie Salmon to you fullas) has been hammered by commerical perse seining and then sold off shore (yes to Australia mainly) as cray fish bait. The fish stocks have now been reduced significantly as the commerical fishers scopped up enough kahawai stock to serious deplete the bio mass in most of NZ waters.
Now I'm not saying the kahawai is going to be extinct but just alot hard for rec fishers to catch.

Now I have come to the main point - eventually after being screwed by commerical interests that piss in the pocket of the government and fund political campagins the rec fishers of NZ have finally gathered together and filed in the high court a case against the NZ government, particualrly the minster of fishers, Yes we are taking the government on head-on and big time. The commerical interests have in the ususal method blamed the rec fishers for the depletion and counter filed against the government for letting us deplete there stocks.

And finally the ones with more say in the matter some of the Maori tribes have backed the rec fishers and taking the government to task as well.

This is a showdown of grand proportions and should we win will be a test case for recreational fishers - lets hope we succeed and it povides some momentum (and maybe some hope to you Aussies).

good luck and yeap let those pen pushing lard ass politicians know who you will be voting for next time and why....

good luck and tight lines


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## hairymick (Oct 18, 2005)

Heya JB

only one word for that - OUTSTANDING

good luck mate and please keep us posted how you get on.


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## AdrianK (May 30, 2006)

A real pity the Fishing Party could not get fully registered before the State Election last year. I wanted to vote for them, but in my seat had to choose between Green, ALP and Lib. I really did not want to vote for any of those three.
I read in the Courier Mail in the lead-up to the election where Mr Beattie said "there will NOT be a ban on fishing in Moreton Bay". Then last week, his own minister has (predictably) backed down from those comments, when questioned by those interested in fishing, saying, "we can make no such guarantees - science will determine the outcomes of the study"

How mad do politicians make you! (I'm certainly not pointing out the ALP as having a monopoly on saying what people want to hear to win an election, then backing down afterward.)

A problem is that compared to the highly organised, politically savvy, and well funded Green Groups, we fishing groups are a bit of a rabble. 
I sent in to Qld Fishing Monthly, a list of email, phone and postal addresses for every member of state parliament, which is public info, and if included in the magazine, would have made responding easier for readers, but there was no reply/response from the magazine. subsequent editorials just keep harping on how we "HAVE to do something". People won't, unless they are guided better. 
I fear for Moreton Bay, and the fishing I just love there.


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