# Possible Kayak Business Idea



## grinner (May 15, 2008)

saw recently that the port macquarie "learn to surf" schools have been so successful that council is going to make them all tender for the right to run their homegrown successful businesses.(with good only knows what charges) seems a good way to shoot yourself in the foot mr mayor.

typical $$ grab by a council (as per usual) wait til someone gets off his arse and starts a business , than put the squeeze on :twisted: :twisted: suppose the guys who are kicked out can go back to nimbin and get looked after.

but i digress, got me thinking about if, anywhere, there is a learn to kayak fish school or even if someone has thought of buying a 1/2 dozen or so and taking tourists out for a fee.

certainly i think you may do ok on the gold coast for one. the charter boys charge about 200 for a day out and if the weathers bad , they seem to drift the seaway for zip.

just a thought about this as an idea.

i know craig takes school groups on camping trips and there are always plenty of japanese tourists going across to stradbroke in small parties from some kayak business but none seem to be fishing.

as a side question. do these groups also have to pay council a fee. i suppose it costs council quite a bit to fill in the potholes out on the ocean and pump the water in and out to make the tides


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## feelfree09 (May 5, 2009)

im trying to get the finance together to do just that. half a dozen yaks, some rods and bits and pieces and away you go. $100 a day, lunch inclusive.


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## gcfisho (Oct 31, 2009)

I think there is a niche in the market for this Pete and ive thought about it.The main problem for me is im a shit fisherman.


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## KingDan (Feb 25, 2011)

I have pondered about the same but always thought insurance would be the tricky part and you may be limited to sheltered waters and estuaries.

Dan


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

The idea is great, doing what you like and getting paid for it. But.....

Public Liability Insurance and Insurance costs (thousands of $$$$$). Risk of legal liability if owners/trip leaders not highly qualified (guessing sea kayak instructor level 2 say...no idea really, but litigation barristers make squillions out of this stuff if it is not precisely planned, run and continually monitored). Weather, language and comms problems. Trip leader to customer ratio (industry standard) and hence lots of wages and super. Business registration/company structure fees. Government red tape. Safety management system. Staff training. Who will run the office, who will do the marketing?......

Sorry, am I sounding negative? Not for me, but go for it if your heart's in it and you think there's a market. But do lots of homework first.

Finally, lots of people start small businesses along these lines, because they love that sport/pursuit, but end up not doing what they love because of the customers and business hassles/demands. Seen that several times in the rockclimbing/bushwalking sea kayaking areas.

Been there, and it's not easy running a small business in this country. Good idea nonetheless for someone with it all together.


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## kpac (Sep 27, 2011)

There's a few 'day kayak' and 'kayak adventure' groups going in SEQ but i've not heard of a fishing orientated business.
1. There's a fair bit of legal who-ha that you'd need to be aware of:
- liability of participants/insurance (i could imagine this would be quite $$
- If you acted uninsured, i'd be awful worried about a law suit if something went wrong
2. Fishing equipment and gear, would need to be provided, and in which learn to fish' could well take up most the time...

Not withstanding the above, it's a great idea. And one well worth pursuing. If you were able to get $100/day as FF09 has said, then youd only really need to average a couple of people daily (more like 5 a day on weekend and 3 a day 2 days during the week) to make the accounts stack up. I think realistically $100 on the gold coast is going to struggle, seeing plenty of charters will offer to take you for bugger-all more than that. But at $50 for a 1/2 day maybe...

If you did want to float the idea, i think you could do a simple "guided tour" type website, which was based on a "at own risk/accept not liability" type of offering, and knock it up on a couple of websites, you'd soon get an idea of viability. Just 2 or 3 yaks would get you started this way to see if there's strong enough interest. If you got regular punters, THEN i'd look at the business technicalities of it, not before hand.

If you got some decent community re pour i would imagine it could work quite well as a 2 person part time thing..


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## grinner (May 15, 2008)

feelfree, good luck with that, i think it would have to be more profitable than a $300,000 charter boat, fuel and 2 deckies wages.

roger, you and i would have to sub contract to plasman and clarkey.

dan, sunshine coast would also be a great spot.

i dont know what the insurance would be. couldnt be as high as the parasailing and skydiving on the coast.

ideally a canalfront location with a pontoon so you dont have all the haulage and parking issues.

possibly even hinze dam would be good.

kpac...love your suggestions mate


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## spooled1 (Sep 16, 2005)

Where's Emufingers when you need him?
This is a great one for the risk assessment team to get involved in.

Here's my perspective - Just do it until someone complains and most importantly, don't p#ss anyone off in the process. If the Goodie two shoe, unimaginable, jealous loser twirp brigade don't complain in the first 6 months, you're virtually on the home stretch because you'll become part of the local furniture before those boring trouble makers realise they may have missed out on a possible income stream.


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## keza (Mar 6, 2007)

It would be a great thing to do in another country but not in this one. The legal will have you totally over it before you start.
The easiest way would be to start off the back of some one who is set up to do non fishing kayak trips.
You would also need to be in a spot that had reasonably consistent fishing.
My choice would be an island resort that has facilities for the ladies to get pampered while the blokes fish.
Someone following along in a tinny with drinks and sarnies would be good.


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## feelfree09 (May 5, 2009)

grinner said:


> feelfree, good luck with that, i think it would have to be more profitable than a $300,000 charter boat, fuel and 2 deckies wages.
> 
> way i see it, for 30k+/- i could be in business. doing what i love. and hopefully promoting the guts out of yak fishing which would be ideal. even if i had to work a side job to get by for 6mths or so it would be worth it. only problem i can really see is that fishing in adelaide in winter kinda sucks.
> 
> someone mentioned that the learning to fish thing might take up a whole day, how is that bad? means they're going to wanna come out again and test their knowledge.


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## yankatthebay (Dec 14, 2007)

There is a guy that does that up this way. He always has his trailer of kayaks down by the waterfront and has about 15 of them or so (most of them are tandems).


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## richo23 (May 17, 2009)

We had a local bloke set up just this type of operation about two years ago here in Hervey Bay. He had a fleet of Hobies, little bus and trailer set up and targeted the Backpacker market. I met up with him several times on the water with clients and he seemed to have the perfect job. 
As the backpacker market is dependant on the weaker Aussie dollar clients have virtually dried up and last I heard he had given all the gear to a friend to see if he could make a go of it, sad really as this is the ideal area to run kayak tours. We have plenty of freshwater options as well as the salt and overheads are still reasonably low. Not sure what qualifications he had but I'm sure he had a senior resus. certificate as well as first aid qualifications.
I had better not give too much away as while I am typing this it seems like something I could make a go of. ;-) 
Richo.


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## emufingers (Aug 11, 2010)

Emufingers is lurking still. 
There is already a business in Adelaide that does kayak tours. I Suspect they know all the business issues.

http://www.adventurekayak.com.au/

Feelfree 09 You could save the effort of financing and offer your services so that they could extend their offerings to include fishing

Risk analysis ( A start anyway)
Your clients may or may not have a reasonable idea of their own swimming ability so you would need to insist on PFD 1 (either the ugly ones or the self inflating types)
Fit kayak with permanent neutral buoyancy or multiple compartments
Develop a risk management plan that sets out
High risk clients that would be excluded eg persons with cardiac problems or lung problems
Ratio of guides to clients
Training of guides eg lifesaving rescue and first aid quals
Legal disclaimer for minor injuries such as treble in the ear lobe, minor cuts etc or Provision of bait or lures so that knives are not necessary
Detailed assessment of waters travelled and planned response to weather and tide hazards
Plan for rescue in event of a serious illness or injury.

The main reason for all this is to convince your insurance company to charge a reasonable price for public liability insurance. There is very little regulation targeted at this area.

IT sounds like a lot of paperwork but it is not that hard. Once it is done it needs review but probably not too much change over time.

The one big issue I see is whether or not Shark repellent technology should be used. AT present the jury is out on whether Sharkshields are effective enough to be included as a routine workplace safety equipment. It is possible best to choose low risk waters such as West Lakes and Port river.


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## ELM (Jul 14, 2008)

I looked at supplying kayaks for scuba divers and AI's for sailing/fishing here on the Mornington Peninsula. It seems quite a few others have had similar idea's and approached the council as did I. Should have kept my mouth shut.

If you speak to them, and you meet the clients on site with the kayaks, they want you to nominate launch sites and of course the necessary fee's that go with it. To also justify their positions, they would have to do an impact study in regard to public parking and the spaces your clients would use (specially if you were using boat ramps) as well as erosion to the beaches used, if you did not use the boat ramps.
If the clients collect the kayaks from home with no instruction on use, it's open slather. That's where the insurance company's rub their hands together because of the heightened risk involved (no leader/instruction). If you are acting as a tour leader; Kayak Training (leader)? Swimming ability? First Aid training? Safety Equipment? Rescue Plans? Communication Equipment? ETC ETC.

If the QLD OH&S is anything like where kayaks/tourism are involved, like they are with scuba & tourism, god help you and best of luck.


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## spooled1 (Sep 16, 2005)

emufingers said:


> Emufingers is lurking still.


Onya Jerry ;-)

Grinner - I'm not trying to be disheartening. In a perfect world I can't see why you shouldn't be able to buy a couple of yaks and make a buck on yer own bat like they do in every other 3rd world country? Seriously mate, I love winning 300 MILLION in the lotteries every week and I can't see why every Australian with an email address can't be just as lucky.


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## Davey G (Jan 15, 2006)

I looked into this a few years ago - not just a fishing specific business but a general kayak tours/paddle fitness type operation with up to 20 kayaks, based in Cronulla Sydney. Council were pushing the 'tourism' angle at the time.

the problem that I encountered was that my local council (god bless 'em) simply would not issue the require permits to operate a 'business' on public land (ie the beach where I intended to meet/launch etc). There was no available storage space available where I wanted to run the business from so the idea was to use a kayak trailer to bring the yaks in/out each day, arrange the group to meet in the local park next to the launch spot at a designated time and operate the business / bookings from an office in the main street of Cronulla about 500 metres from the launch spot (maximising exposure).

The problem was that I simply could not get the council guys to even consider issuing a permit, so my plan was stuffed before i really got into the logistics. However I note there are now a couple of other similar operations (paddleboard schools etc) operating from the same spot so obviously it could be done - I just either didn't know the right people at council, didnt play the game properly or didnt offer a big enough wad of cash to secure my permits.

At the end of the day I also added up costs/potential profits/seasonal factors and it was only ever going to be a small earner so i didnt pursue it - but I think in tourist areas with warm climates (QLD) it should/could be a goer year-round


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## Rhino (Dec 17, 2007)

A guy here in Victoria has been running one out of East Gippsland for a while now.

http://fulltothebream.com/


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## RedPhoenix (Jun 13, 2006)

Unfortunately, due to the change in ownership of this web site and the lack of response by the owners to my requests to remove my email address from all administrative-level notifications and functionality, I have decided to remove my posts on AKFF. Thank you for the great times, the fantastic learning experiences and the many many fish. If you are desperate for the old content of this particular post, it is available below base64 encoded and bzip2 compressed.

Red.

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## garyp (May 30, 2008)

Lapse said:


> I reckon the logistics of chasing after 6 kayak newbies would ruin the experience.
> None of them knowing how to paddle you would limit you to within a couple of km of launching point, you would have to have everyone under your eye at once and can you imagine trying to untangle & unknot your clients lines if they are drifting 100m apart? I think that it would take away the advantages of yakfishing: ie, going where you want when you want.


When I dream of winning Lotto and what I would choose to do to keep me busy, I inveriably think of the same idea Grinner.

When I follow it through to its logical conclusion I come up with the same barriers that Lapse does above.

Would be cool in theory & maybe even profitable, but very difficult to do it well. Might be better off charging a premium and only taking one max two people at a time


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## grinner (May 15, 2008)

hearing you gary,

to be honest i'm just tossing the idea up there for someone else.

its something i would maybe look into in a decade or so when i retire .

rhino, the prices should pay off his yaks pretty quick , though i would imagine he is taking out people for 1 on 1 tuition.

lapse, you have hit the nail on the head. people everywhere unlike on a charter boat where you can get over to their tangled rigs in a matter of seconds.

davey g , i do wonder about councils. those crazy jetboats and parasailing on the gold coast broadwater are accidents waiting to happen but seem to get approved in increasing numbers.
i wonder if paddleboarder schools would also need the green light from lifesavers and if the shore break has different considerations to calm waters.

and thanks to charles (bluezooky) for sending me this link which i'll post here.
http://www.bundeenakayaks.com.au/

so it seems it will be a growing market.

thanks everyone for input and hopefully someone got some ideas.


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## RedPhoenix (Jun 13, 2006)

Unfortunately, due to the change in ownership of this web site and the lack of response by the owners to my requests to remove my email address from all administrative-level notifications and functionality, I have decided to remove my posts on AKFF. Thank you for the great times, the fantastic learning experiences and the many many fish. If you are desperate for the old content of this particular post, it is available below base64 encoded and bzip2 compressed.

Red.

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QlpoOTFBWSZTWdgiuzUAAC7XgAAQQOc4YBAAP+/fsDABEsBFPE1Gg9TTQ00A0AUYEaE1Bp6gHlNNA00JMVPxTDSZTynqDCLDknQO+WvjXK44YKSQQLmqFHf1Iaqmk0kezAFiecVGhDajymTjoDRAmWojuerWraZptkXuvcxd2g/ScjQWjKTkYr2n1EpgxnCJgwW70GhVwUQu9gRq+l3fx6xpIUfq/H1oEiNGBDBstiSjGinJgxDhms/WOrwTKIYN5VMOw/ORvbkVzUOTjdnsqgnkqQHcu7tBMTPx2hNdLjy2YgfY2bhO4XTqrAEXJN7vU61seIx9Hb2q7mrULSDWSG6t8ZjCMpR7w1lgk0iRczwUArCCVInmFyWEQ8kmJLQgP/i7kinChIbBFdmo


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## kpac (Sep 27, 2011)

indiedog said:


> Red, I thought the same thing. Wasn't sure just how much of the income the parent company would want but worth investigating.


Bugger all if you can show it would add to their business also .....


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## Baitman (Aug 1, 2009)

Hey Grinner,

Might be worth having a chat to the guys that run those tours down the Brisbane River to see how they operate, the costs, the risks, pricing, etc. Seeing as you are not looking to compete with them I imagine they would have no issue with speaking to you.

Also remember that if you are hitting the tourist market you will need to run accommodation pick-ups and drops offs.

Personally I think it would be too much work for too little reward. Your earnings will be limited to how many pax you can take out. Do a back of envelope on six kayaks and you will see that you would struggle to feed yourself after costs. Tour Desks take 20% comm straight away. Would be hard work too - setting up and cleaning up after would be a few hours (the clients don't do this) each day.

Dealing with idiot tourists would also take the gloss off working on the water!

Cheers


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## bildad (Jun 20, 2011)

kayakone said:


> The idea is great, doing what you like and getting paid for it. But.....
> 
> Public Liability Insurance and Insurance costs (thousands of $$$$$).


I knew a bloke up here tried it seemed that taking people kayaking was ok (liability affordable), but as soon as fishing was mentioned the Public liability went through the roof. You also need to have up to date first aid certificate.
Of course if anybody got hurt but didn't come back..........


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## goanywhere (Feb 22, 2011)

And that my dear friends is one reason why this country is now pretty well stuffed as a place for entrepreneurs. Bureaucrats and self-important professional stuffer-uppers have made many small business opportunities all but impossible. Thirty years ago this would have been a no-brainer and someone would be doing very nicely from such a business. Now it's a legal and bureaucratic minefield. It may still be workable but I would tread very cautiously! :?


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

SMALL BUSINESS (as defined by the Australian Bureau of Statistics):-

A small business is defined as a business employing less than 20 people. Categories of small businesses include:

.non-employing businesses - sole proprietorships and partnerships without employees; 
.micro businesses - businesses employing less than 5 people, including non-employing businesses; 
.other small businesses - businesses employing 5 or more people, but less than 20 people;

Small businesses tend to have the following management or organisational characteristics: 
.independent ownership and operations; 
.close control by owners/managers who also contribute most, if not all the operating capital; and 
.principal decision-making by the owners/managers.

It is estimated that there were 1,233,200 private sector small businesses in Australia during 2000-01 which represented 97% of all private sector businesses These small businesses employed almost 3.6 million people, 49% of all private sector employment.

And if you have a good idea, what do you get for all that? You get more red tape than China can produce in a year. This has got to be the most over-governed country in the world. You even need a permit to fart. Is this Federal and State governments running rampant to pay for the fat salaries of public servants? And they're still bankrupting the country, while small business owners work 12 - 14 hours a day?

Start a small business? Not bloody likely!


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