# Why I am having trouble committing...



## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

... to a Stealth Profisha...

There is a new breed of SIK starting to build a niche market for fishing. And speed. And rolling. And surfing. And "playfulness" or switched on feed back to the paddler in bouncy windy conditions, rock gardens etc. And for full on yak based camping.

These designs tend to be around 5.5m long, narrow compared to a fishing SOT, reasonable rocker, but with a flat centre section for surfing (provides stability for fishing), low rear for low windage and the more advanced Greenland rolling skills. No they are not all things to all people, but a clever compromise that is fishable but still let's you play with the other SIKs in pretty much whatever specialty your SIK mates enjoy.

http://tideraceseakayaks.wordpress.com/ ... ar-really/
http://www.tideraceseakayaks.co.uk/inde ... eries.html

Zegul have something special coming too which was jointly developed with the local Rob Mercer.

My Zegul ticks the box for fishing, stability, speed, rolling, but it doesn't do well fully loaded and camping.

If you are up for extending your paddling skill sets and hunting for speed... Might be worth checking out!


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## TheFishinMusician (Feb 5, 2007)

Porn!


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## gbc (Feb 16, 2012)

I've been watching this movement in adventure kayak mag u.k. online. Short of surfing I don't do any of the 'tidal race/rock garden' type stuff that these are so good at. Doesn't mean I don't want one though


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## Wrassemagnet (Oct 17, 2007)

Dru that's a beautiful kayak dude! I can see why you're torn. Whatever choice you finally make will be the right one but won't you miss hanging your feet over the sides if you go with a sik? You've got to have a go of my loaded up ck575 in the joggle before committing. At the moment looks like next chance for me to get out will be after Boxing Day but I'll let u know


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Gotta have a go on Stevie's 475 too. Logic says its the one. But who said upgrading a yak was about logic?


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## scater (Nov 24, 2007)

I'm thinking a 475 might be in my future too, damn they purrty.


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## theclick (Jun 25, 2007)

I must admit, i have contemplated doing some fishing out of my greenland t, but just cant bring myself to drilling a hole in her. overall, these style of yaks are very fishable, and if you can figure out rod and fish storage, perfect for surf landings.

Get one dru


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## sbd (Aug 18, 2006)

Nice boat dru. How do you surf launch a SIK?


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2012)

dru said:


> Gotta have a go on Stevie's 475 too. Logic says its the one. But who said upgrading a yak was about logic?


Dru I would say to get Jim to this as well so you can jump from one to the other and get a proper felling for the difference.


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## paulb (Nov 12, 2006)

Looks like a nice paddler - though I wouldn't fancy my chances of a Greenland roll, if a decent king was still on the end of the line.


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

sbd said:


> Nice boat dru. How do you surf launch a SIK?


With great difficulty at times. Unless you are one of the highly skilled few (Rob Mercer, Gary Forrest competance levels.... there are many others there as well, and I'm not), you are usually putting on your skirt on wet sand, around the limit of the biggest wave wash. Then you try to move the kayak seawards with your knuckles till you have enough water to paddle. The trouble is, when 'knuckling out', you have no speed and no steering, and what often happens is, you get hit by a wash twhile not quite square on, and get turned 90 degrees, and end up where you came from and side on, getting smacked by each successsive washes. Sort of beached whale syndrome. 
Now you must break the skirt, get out and relign your yak seawards, and proceed to *repeat all of the above scenario*.

Here is a video of how to. There's a great tip here for relignigning your yak after being knocked parallel to the break:






There is one other technique I have used. As you are being washed sideways in to your starting point, extend your paddle forwards to the bow and perform a 'modified' bow draw of the blade away from the bow (or a reverse rudder on the beach side which requires considerable skill, and luck, to avoid a capsize). This can turn the bow further towards the beach, and leave the rear pointing somewhat seawards. Now you are waiting for sufficient wash to float you, and you paddle out backwards, until you can safely turn the yak to face the waves head-on.

trev


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Dave: I'm thinking K1 has it. I don't particularly feel nervous about getting the skirt on in surf though... Noting that I rarely do it, and not in serious conditions. Bigger issue is staying on your feet once in the surf. Aparantly a rock solid roll makes all the difference, constant wet exits and solo remounts While being battered by surf would be sole destroying. Not to mention what happens to your reels.

My answer at the moment is to avoid it. I really don't mind a lengthy paddle to get to spot x, 10k is fine. Yes I'll plan the trip with tide and current and wind but otherwise fine. In Sydney I don't think I need to surf launch for any of the key spots. For the heads I launch at Vauclse Houe or Vaucluse. Longie doesn't need surf as long as you avoid NNE swell which are unusual. Kurnell through to Malabar I launch at Lappers.

Paul: strangely enough my biggest fear is one step after you're thinking. Upside down, paddle in hand, and 15lb braid acting like a garrot across my throat under tension from a king. I'm cautious with my drag settings, with paddle in hand plan A is to roll up, allow a single attempt (normally I do up to 3) then plan B wet exit. With rod in hand, free spool then wet exit. Cut the line if needed before remount. Likely risk here is a rod tip wrap that I miss.

To be honest though, how often does anyone fall out on hook up? Don't think the likelihood is much different on one of these SIKs. Albeit, the ramifications serious enough to merit a plan. :shock:


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## sbd (Aug 18, 2006)

Thanks for the vids Trev, the first one is very informative, the second one is nuts (in a good way).

I'd be concerned to have a shiny new glass SIK & have to drag it along the sand with my knuckles, I'd weep for the gelcoat. Almost be easier to tow it out past the break & do a wet entry wouldn't it?


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

sbd said:


> Nice boat dru. How do you surf launch a SIK?


With some considerable difficulty Dave, quite a bit of the time (not talking the skills set level of the of Rob Mercer, Gary Forrest, Eddie Safarak etc, and many other like highly-skilled sea kayakers).

The technique is:

Carry the kayak to the highest reach of the waves, then get in and seal the spray skirt. Now you have to knuckle your way out into a paddleable depth of water. The problem here is that just as you are about to reach for the paddle, you get hit while you're not square to the wave, and the instant result is turning the kayak side on and side surfing you into the beach, back where you came from. You now have to break the skirt, get out, and relign your yak with the waves, and start all over again.

Here's a good video of how to:






trev


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## sbd (Aug 18, 2006)

There's an echo in here Trev. Have we started the shandies early? So you should, you've earned them.

There's just one thing I'm wondering though, how do you surf launch a SIK?


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

sbd said:


> There's an echo in here Trev. Have we started the shandies early? So you should, you've earned them.
> 
> There's just one thing I'm wondering though, how do you surf launch a SIK?


No shandies at all Dave, though I did have 2 glasses of wine total at two functions yesterday. Also, I thought the video on how to was thorough. Not cutting the mustard?

I didn't know the first post had even gone up ... it disappeared from my screen and I thought it was lost in cyberspace.

trev


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## sbd (Aug 18, 2006)

kayakone said:


> sbd said:
> 
> 
> > There's an echo in here Trev. Have we started the shandies early? So you should, you've earned them.
> ...


I'm just teasing you Trev, excellent and informative replies both times thank you. I hope you & yours enjoy all the best over the Christmas season and into 2013 & beyond. That goes for the rest of you too.


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

indiedog said:


> Dru, you should know that a single yak cannot do everything. Two yaks is your answer.


Yep, the problem is which 2? Looking at the perfect world, my short list reads like this:
Epic V10S for speed, fitness and playing in runners
Valley Aquanaut for big conditions and surfing
Tiderace Pace 18 or Rockpool Taran for multi day camping at pace
Plastic SOT like the Swing for fresh, tight, portage, rapids and estuarine and in among the oyster beds.
Here's something interesting, for fishing in the blue, I think the Stealth Evolution 465 is my perfect yak.
While I don't need a Greenland kayak, it'll be needed unless one of the SIKs is fun to roll.

Now here's the trick, find compromise yaks to cover the above and you may only have 2. Oh, and SWMBO wants to use one, probably for short weekend camp trips down the freshwater.

A couple of possible combinations then, noting that pretty few of the ideal specific yaks won't make the cut list when I am needing compromise.

Taran + 475. Hit: speed, fitness, camping, fishing. Miss: rolling, surfing.
575 + tide race Xplore. Hit: fishing, speed camping. Miss: rolling surfing
Zegul 550 + Stealth Toura: until recently I have favoured this. Hit: fishing (almost), speed, fitness, rolling (almost), Surfing. Miss: camping and serious fishing.
475 + Tiderace Xcite. Hang on a tick... May be on to something... It's all compromise, but not bad, not bad....

Don't hang around, I'll get back to you...


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

eric said:


> How about three kayaks then?


Now we're talking. Slippery slope. :?


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## bazzoo (Oct 17, 2006)

Ahhhhhhhh Dear, always decisions , those sit ins have an awful lot of rocker , and would suffer in straight line speed , also bear in mind the small cockpit hatch which is difficult to get in but even harder to get out especially if you are injured in any way . so naturally i am all in favour of a lovely fast Stealth with reasonable rocker to enable it to surf and still have straight line speed , ask the men who drive them champion , we better organise a lunch in Feb or thereabouts , have a great christmas Dru


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

eric said:


> How about three kayaks then?


It gets easier with 5 or more.

trev


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## Squidley (May 8, 2010)

Occulator said:


> Don't do it dude, don't let the side down. Don't betray your SIK mates.


Me & my fully SIK boys


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## Scott (Aug 29, 2005)

One of my regular customers has a tiderace which I always admire as it is normally on the roof racks. The build finish is bullshit, absolutely flawless. He was in again today and I mentioned this thread and the excite. He said it wasn't the one he had, he had the one above it. He uses it for surfing and absolutely loves it. He still has a Taran but his wife made him sell his other four. He said his one, despite having quite a bit of rocker is still extremely fast and tracks very well in the hands of a competent paddler. He beach launches his one and regularly launches and surfs popular local surfing breaks when the swell is up.


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## Junglefisher (Jun 2, 2008)

3 kayaks? How could anyone live with only 3 kayaks?


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

Scott said:


> One of my regular customers has a tiderace which I always admire as it is normally on the roof racks. The build finish is bullshit, absolutely flawless. He was in again today and I mentioned this thread and the excite. He said it wasn't the one he had, he had the one above it. He uses it for surfing and absolutely loves it. He still has a Taran but his wife made him sell his other four. He said his one, despite having quite a bit of rocker is still extremely fast and tracks very well in the hands of a competent paddler. He beach launches his one and regularly launches and surfs popular local surfing breaks when the swell is up.


Some of the sea kayak designs, in good hands, are incredible play machines. High energy, high skills, and adreneline overload. These are old, but the skill levels are unquestionable, i.e. very high






:


Junglefisher said:


> 3 kayaks? How could anyone live with only 3 kayaks?


Exactly Craig. You win the prize! :lol:

trev


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

Brad, the new category of super fast ski inspired SIKs with enough volume for camping... tend not to really be sufficiently stable for fishing. I wet tested the Epic, Tahe Wind and Zegul 550. Chose the Zegul, Epic came a long third, no way I could fish from it. I don't know the Point, but admit that the Spyder is a fascinating kayak. Still if I was to choose in this category I'd be testing the Tiderace Pace and the Tahe Taran. And I wouldn't expect to fish from either.

The Zegul is so far the best compromise for speed AND enough stability to fish from.

The Xcite would be a little slower, much more playful, and better volume for camping. Two other SIKs that might come close are the Rockpool GT and the Raider X (made by Rosco in Brisbane)... But I suspect the Zegul and Xcite would top the list for speed fishing SIKs.

Btw if I am to go for an outright speed machine with no consideration for fishing... Probably wouldn't be a sea kayak. Plan C is fermenting. :?


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

The Pittarak has an odd reputation. The guy who designed it was probably one of Aus' best sea kayakers. He developed almost cult like support. But then there are others who just dont rate it, equal in reputation to the designer. I haven't paddled one so can't comment other than its interesting. Rosco are about to update the Raider.

Been measuring the side of the house, surely I can fit another yak there somewhere.


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