# Oops...I think I'm sinking!



## Desal

I went chasing mackeral at Palm Beach reef yesterday but things didn't quite turn out how I planned. Due to the dirty water in shore, I was on my way out to join the rest of the pack about 3k off shore. Well, I got about 2k out and heard a knocking noise coming from inside my Hobie Revo. Popped the hatch and gasp - 4" of water in hull. My tackle box was floating around inside and bumping the deck.
I had read posts about Hobies developing splits around the hull penetration for the Mirage drive and assumed I had one so after bailing out the hull, I packed up and made revolutions for 26 knots homeward bound. After bailing the hull 3 times on the way in, I made a very sluggish re-entry through the surf zone with a yak full of water.
In turns out, the plastic supporting the locking lugs for the mirage drive had cracked and was letting water in. I was lucky the piece didn't break out altogether. My friendly Hobie dealer says I will probably get a new boat with the update locking mechanism as I am still 6months inside my 2yr warranty. One thing about Hobie, they always make good on their products! (even outside the warranty period).

Some Points to Ponder
1. Always have a suitable container for bailing out your yak and a piece of towel for plugging holes.
2. Does your yak float when full of water? Hobies do.
3. I carry the inflatable wheels for my cart inside the rear hatch and my hard plastic Plano tackle box both add extra floatation
4. My mobile phone was fully charged and in a water tight Pelikan hard case - just in case.
5. My wife knew where I was and when I was expected home.
6. If your yak suffers a hull breach, always stay with the yak.
regards
Neil


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## craig51063

i know im going to cop flack but y does this seem to happen mostly to hobies .

2ks of the coast , had to bail out the hull 3 or 4 times . what if the seas came up or the wind came up or even being sussed out by a gws ... u would have been up shit creek without a paddle . [ no pun intended ] i beleive they have changed the disign and put in stainless clips to add strength to the area .im glad they also look after there customers so well

but this is one of the main reasons i do not have a hobie as yet . they just dont seem reliable enough for me as it seems to much like russian rulette.. ie some good some not.

this could have easerly been a life threatening situation ,glad u made it back safe and all is ok ............... but i would not be very happy if it was me .

craig


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## Guest

Glad you made it home in one piece Neil.

Its great that you are looking on the bright side and saying that your Hobie kayak will float when full of water (as if its superior design at work) :lol: love it 8)


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## Peril

kittygogo said:


> 2. Does your yak float when full of water? Hobies do.


Are you sure?









And Craig, you're being unkind. This only happens to old hobies. The fault has been rectified in each new model since it was first discovered


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## sandyfreckle

2010 models apparently have been constructed with changes to the mirage drive housing to prevent these hull breaches.
I've pedalled the crap out of mine and have not had more than a couple of drops in the hull from opening hatches at sea.
Glad you got back in and that they're gonna sort you out with an alternative product for your well spent money.

Cheers. Good luck.


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## sandyfreckle

And it's funny to see the influx of "hobie=good" and "hobie=bad" comments in a very short period of time.
The "haves" and "have nots"???


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## Guest

sandyfreckle said:


> And it's funny to see the influx of "hobie=good" and "hobie=bad" comments in a very short period of time.
> The "haves" and "have nots"???


Hardly mate.....I can afford to own any kayak I choose, so its hardly a case of 'haves' and 'have nots'.

I was also not saying Hobies are bad at all, I just thought it was optimistic to pitch the Hobie as superior because it floats half full of water :shock:


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## Greybeard

See if he still gets his new Hobie if he doesn't remove the post when requested by hobie like happened to me. Reputable companies would have recalled the lot My opinion 
Greybeard


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## kayaksportsmark

sandyfreckle said:


> And it's funny to see the influx of "hobie=good" and "hobie=bad" comments in a very short period of time.
> The "haves" and "have nots"???


More like the "wants" and "want nots".
Kayaks are tailor made for a purpose and those who take the time to research the best craft for their use will buy accordingly.


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## bazzoo

Greybeard , hope all is well with your Hobie now mate , i look at your address lake Macquarie and drool , interesting that they asked you to remove the post .


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## sandyfreckle

Strewth.
Congratulations Dallas, you've obviously purchased a craft well suited to your needs and within your budget.
"Have" and "Have Nots" did not have to be taken the way you gentlemen may have taken it.
If you have chosen to purchase one then good luck to you, if it doesn't leak then better luck to you.
If you went with one of the hundred other manufacturers out there then you've done well too.

This is almost as bad a Ford v Holden, Toyota v Nissan, Apple v Mac, VB v XXXX, I could go on....


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## craig51063

its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????

i mean they have recognized and fixed a problem so doesnt that make them responsable for the old designs as well .

i mean toyata are recalling there flagship car arnt they ???

holdens - fords ???????????????????????????????????????????? go the holdens

craig


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## sandyfreckle

craig51063 said:


> its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????
> 
> i mean they have recognized and fixed a problem so doesnt that make them responsable for the old designs as well .
> craig


That's a very interesting point Craig, nicely said.


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## madfishman

Good to see you made it back in ok and sorry to hear about the leak, sounds like it took on a lot of water on your trip.

As a *Hobie Cult *member ( and as expected, throwing my 2cents in) and Landrover owner, ( not landcruiser..booo hiss hiss) , i am pretty happy with the support from hobie in the past on different matters with friends and others ive heard and read in this forum , and as always good to see any company standing behind its products. When we were up in NSW a few weeks ago for the St bgeorges basin abt round Steve gave us a tour of the factory and i was not suprised at the passion and suppoort these guys offer all their customers, right through to the hobiecats that they make at the factory.

Good luck in the future .

Great post about safety and having the right gear on any vessel in the water, this should be mandatory and is the law..


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## Guest

sandyfreckle said:


> This is almost as bad a Ford v Holden, Toyota v Nissan, Apple v Mac, VB v XXXX, I could go on....


I quite like the Hobie range of kayaks 8) dont get me wrong


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## Feral

Strewth, thats a bit


sandyfreckle said:


> craig51063 said:
> 
> 
> 
> its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????
> 
> i mean they have recognized and fixed a problem so doesnt that make them responsable for the old designs as well .
> craig
> 
> 
> 
> That's a very interesting point Craig, nicely said.
Click to expand...

If its as common as that I wonder why Fair Trading have not forced a recall?


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## craig51063

Feral said:


> Strewth, thats a bit
> 
> 
> sandyfreckle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> craig51063 said:
> 
> 
> 
> its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????
> 
> i mean they have recognized and fixed a problem so doesnt that make them responsable for the old designs as well .
> craig
> 
> 
> 
> That's a very interesting point Craig, nicely said.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If its as common as that I wonder why Fair Trading have not forced a recall?
Click to expand...

Do they know ??? has anyone complained ?????

maybe there not into yaking ??? 

craig


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## mustrumr

craig51063 said:


> its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????


As I understand it this is not something that they can fix by a retrofit - it's a design flaw in the old model, and there is no way to retrofit the new system to the old hull. I thought the drive well crack problem was confined to the 08 and earlier models, not the 09 models with the click and go drive system. Or am I wrong?

But either way surely Hobie should be recalling ALL the hulls with this problem and replacing them, or repairing them if this is possible, not waiting for people to be putting themselves at serious risk of a kayaking tragedy. Somebody could die in a worst case scenario; I imagine that Hobie would be held legally responsible for failing to recall the affected kayaks, since Hobie knows about this problem: there's a post from Matt Miller of Hobie Cat USA on the Hobie Kayak forum that describes the drive well crack problem as "well known" https://www.hobiecat.com/community/view ... =11&t=2973 (this dates back to 2006). Unfortunately, even though I am a member of the Hobie forum, when I try to click on the link in this post to the FAQ on the drive well crack problem I get a message that says "you are not authorised to read this forum"!!!! This does not inspire confidence.

Cheers,


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## craig51063

Greybeard said:


> See if he still gets his new Hobie if he doesn't remove the post when requested by hobie like happened to me. Reputable companies would have recalled the lot My opinion
> Greybeard


WHAT ?????????????? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

craig


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## Greybeard

Graig I probably worded that wrong I did get a new kayak but was wondering what would happen if you refused to remove the post when requested by hobie like they requested me to do.


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## ant

Neil
I feel guilty I left you on your own out there :shock: :shock: . It always pays to have a buddy although you will have to get up earlier, I'd finished as you were going out. Stealth are doing great deals on yaks at the moment and they do float when full of water :twisted: :twisted: It would seem from the above comments Hobie are aware of the issue, I wonder what get out of jail clause they have should a loss of life occur because of this reoccurring fault with their product   .

Cheers
Ant


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## WayneD

The only problem I have with Hobie is that they fill up when upside down and getting smashed in the surf, but mine is a 2009 model. Also there is no rod storage on them so my $200 rod was broken but it was on the paddle keeper not inside the hull as it wouldn't fit. The fault with yours is well documented and Hobie provide excellent support. So do any other kayak manufacturers that I have dealt with actually.

Ant - Stealth do have some good deals at the moment and I am talks with Mick and Des :twisted: . Which one to choose is the hardest part, Supalite or Evo.


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## craig51063

Greybeard said:


> Graig I probably worded that wrong I did get a new kayak but was wondering what would happen if you refused to remove the post when requested by hobie like they requested me to do.


oh ok BUT why would they request you to remove a thread ????? was the thread about the hull cracking ??

craig


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## Greybeard

Yes (and you are thinking the same as i do) but was trying to get my kayak replaced so conformed but don't agree with it.
Cheers Rowley


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## Bart70

Greybeard said:


> See if he still gets his new Hobie if he doesn't remove the post when requested by hobie like happened to me. Reputable companies would have recalled the lot My opinion
> Greybeard


Funny Greybeard,

They never said anything like that to me when mine was replaced?? Might have more to do with the content of the posts perhaps.....

Neil,

Glad you made it back safe - some very good points you raise about being prepared for when things go wrong. When we head out time after time and never have a problem it is easy to overlook the little things that you may need one day. Posts like yours are great reminders to us all as to what can go wrong without any warning.

Bart70


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## Bart70

Feral said:


> Strewth, thats a bit
> 
> 
> sandyfreckle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> craig51063 said:
> 
> 
> 
> its good that hobie have improved and acted on a disign fault with the new models BUT shouldnt they now do a recall of all the mirage drive yaks and retro fit them with this new component as well ?????
> 
> i mean they have recognized and fixed a problem so doesnt that make them responsable for the old designs as well .
> craig
> 
> 
> 
> That's a very interesting point Craig, nicely said.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If its as common as that I wonder why Fair Trading have not forced a recall?
Click to expand...

For a couple of reasons Feral,

1. It is not as common as a few loud voices on the internet claim it is.
2. You will probably find in most cases the customer has been left satisfied with the way it was handled by the manufacturer - those who are not are quite at liberty to lodge a complaint but I would suggest the majority would not have a leg to stand on hence why it has not happened and Hobie have not been bought to their knees in the fashion that the 'backyard lawyers' claim they should be on internet forums.

We see these threads every few months......The backyard lawyers come out of their holes, jump on their soapboxes, then go back where they came from. None of them actually take the issue that they feel is so wrong up with the people that they keep claiming can fix it. Wouldn't you think if these individuals REALLY thought lives were at risk they would want to go to the authorities and ensure nobody gets hurt? Funny they don't do it.....

Not sure why..... ;-)


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## Bart70

patwah said:


> Personally, I'd like to see more questions marks in this thread, I love question marks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Don't start.....or the Pyrmont boys will hijack the the thread and talk in binary....then none of us will have a clue what outrageous claims are being made ;-) ;-) ;-)


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## zipper

01101101 01100101 01101100 01100010 01101111 01110101 01110010 01101110 01100101 00100000 01101011 01101001 01100100 01110011 00100000 01100011 01100001 01101110 00100000 01110100 01100001 01101100 01101011 00100000 01100010 01101001 01101110 01100001 01110010 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110011 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00101110 00100000 01101101 01100001 01111001 01100010 01100101 00100000 01101010 01110101 01110011 01110100 00100000 01101110 01101111 01110100 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101111 01110010 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110011 01101100 01100001 01101110 01100100 01100101 01110010 01101111 01110101 01110011 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 00100000 01110000 01111001 01110010 01101101 01101111 01101110 01110100 00100000 01100010 01101111 01111001 01110011 00101110 00100000 01100100 01100001 01101101 01101110 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110010 01100101 00100000 01100111 01101111 01101111 01100100


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## madfishman

zipper said:


> 01101101 01100101 01101100 01100010 01101111 01110101 01110010 01101110 01100101 00100000 01101011 01101001 01100100 01110011 00100000 01100011 01100001 01101110 00100000 01110100 01100001 01101100 01101011 00100000 01100010 01101001 01101110 01100001 01110010 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110011 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00101110 00100000 01101101 01100001 01111001 01100010 01100101 00100000 01101010 01110101 01110011 01110100 00100000 01101110 01101111 01110100 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101111 01110010 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110011 01101100 01100001 01101110 01100100 01100101 01110010 01101111 01110101 01110011 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 00100000 01110000 01111001 01110010 01101101 01101111 01101110 01110100 00100000 01100010 01101111 01111001 01110011 00101110 00100000 01100100 01100001 01101101 01101110 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110010 01100101 00100000 01100111 01101111 01101111 01100100


I think the mods should chop this guy out , this language is not acceptable use.... ;-)

P.S - zipper , cut the swearing , and no offensive gestures mate.... :twisted: :lol:


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## zipper

madfishman said:


> zipper said:
> 
> 
> 
> 01101101 01100101 01101100 01100010 01101111 01110101 01110010 01101110 01100101 00100000 01101011 01101001 01100100 01110011 00100000 01100011 01100001 01101110 00100000 01110100 01100001 01101100 01101011 00100000 01100010 01101001 01101110 01100001 01110010 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110011 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00101110 00100000 01101101 01100001 01111001 01100010 01100101 00100000 01101010 01110101 01110011 01110100 00100000 01101110 01101111 01110100 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110111 01100101 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101111 01110010 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110011 01101100 01100001 01101110 01100100 01100101 01110010 01101111 01110101 01110011 00100000 01100001 01110011 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 00100000 01110000 01111001 01110010 01101101 01101111 01101110 01110100 00100000 01100010 01101111 01111001 01110011 00101110 00100000 01100100 01100001 01101101 01101110 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 01111001 00100000 01100001 01110010 01100101 00100000 01100111 01101111 01101111 01100100
> 
> 
> 
> I think the mods should chop this guy out , this language is not acceptable use.... ;-)
> 
> P.S - zipper , cut the swearing , and no offensive gestures mate.... :twisted: :lol:
Click to expand...

you know what mate, why don't you just go and 01100011 01100001 01101100 01101100 your mother and 01110100 01100101 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 00100000 01101100 01101111 01110110 01100101 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 until she can't take it any more, then 01110100 01100101 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 00100000 01101101 01101001 01110011 01110011 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 and you want to 01100110 01101001 01111000 00100000 01110101 01110000 00100000 01101000 01100101 01110010 00100000 01100111 01100001 01110010 01100100 01100101 01101110, sure it will be dirty and sweaty but then you can always 01101000 01100001 01110110 01100101 00100000 01100001 00100000 01110011 01101000 01101111 01110111 01100101 01110010 00100000 01100010 01100001 01100011 01101011 00100000 01100001 01110100 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 01110010 00100000 01110000 01101100 01100001 01100011 01100101. yeah....that's what you can go do :lol:


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## craig51063

If its as common as that I wonder why Fair Trading have not forced a recall?[/quote]

For a couple of reasons Feral,

1. It is not as common as a few loud voices on the internet claim it is.
2. You will probably find in most cases the customer has been left satisfied with the way it was handled by the manufacturer - those who are not are quite at liberty to lodge a complaint but I would suggest the majority would not have a leg to stand on hence why it has not happened and Hobie have not been bought to their knees in the fashion that the 'backyard lawyers' claim they should be on internet forums.

We see these threads every few months......The backyard lawyers come out of their holes, jump on their soapboxes, then go back where they came from. None of them actually take the issue that they feel is so wrong up with the people that they keep claiming can fix it. Wouldn't you think if these individuals REALLY thought lives were at risk they would want to go to the authorities and ensure nobody gets hurt? Funny they don't do it.....

Not sure why..... ;-)[/quote]

1- your right its not all that common but i have heard of this happening at least 3 or 4 times in the last 2 years and these are just the ones that we hear about , it has only been hobies with mirage drives that it seems to happen to .

2 - most cases they where satisfied because they basicaly got a new hulls .even after 2 years of use in one case i know of , i dont say that hobie dont stand by there products they have great after sales service and a fantastic warrenty .if they didnt im sure these owners would head to the apropriate authorities .

my gryp is that it does happen and if it happens when your out to sea or the weather conditions come in ,it does not make for a safe craft .

if it wasnt a problem then why would hobie rectify it in there new models ?

i wouldnt be suprised if in a few years the p.as hulls start cracking up . ie turbo fins with a 60kg hull, thats got to be a lot more stress on the hulls than on the other models . time will tell i guess

oh and i have conversations with lawers and not backyard ones about this issue and supposedly hobie would not fair very well in the account of a misshap caused by a hull breach .in fact NO boat manufacturer would .

as ive started before i like hobies but i just dont think there safe yet .

craig


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## paffoh

craig51063 said:


> i wouldnt be suprised if in a few years the p.as hulls start cracking up . time will tell i guess


Speculating only makes you look like more of a tool mate...



> if it wasnt a problem then why would hobie rectify it in there new models ?


Maybe we should of just kept driving around in VN Commodores then?



> as ive started before i like hobies


I have some news for you, I dont think they like you...


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## Bart70

craig51063 said:


> If its as common as that I wonder why Fair Trading have not forced a recall?
> 
> 
> 
> craig51063 said:
> 
> 
> 
> For a couple of reasons Feral,
> 
> 1. It is not as common as a few loud voices on the internet claim it is.
> 2. You will probably find in most cases the customer has been left satisfied with the way it was handled by the manufacturer - those who are not are quite at liberty to lodge a complaint but I would suggest the majority would not have a leg to stand on hence why it has not happened and Hobie have not been bought to their knees in the fashion that the 'backyard lawyers' claim they should be on internet forums.
> 
> We see these threads every few months......The backyard lawyers come out of their holes, jump on their soapboxes, then go back where they came from. None of them actually take the issue that they feel is so wrong up with the people that they keep claiming can fix it. Wouldn't you think if these individuals REALLY thought lives were at risk they would want to go to the authorities and ensure nobody gets hurt? Funny they don't do it.....
> 
> Not sure why..... ;-)
> 
> 
> 
> 1- your right its not all that common but i have heard of this happening at least 3 or 4 times in the last 2 years and these are just the ones that we hear about , it has only been hobies with mirage drives that it seems to happen to .
> 
> 2 - most cases they where satisfied because they basicaly got a new hulls .even after 2 years of use in one case i know of , i dont say that hobie dont stand by there products they have great after sales service and a fantastic warrenty .if they didnt im sure these owners would head to the apropriate authorities .
> 
> my gryp is that it does happen and if it happens when your out to sea or the weather conditions come in ,it does not make for a safe craft .
> 
> if it wasnt a problem then why would hobie rectify it in there new models ?
> 
> i wouldnt be suprised if in a few years the p.as hulls start cracking up . ie turbo fins with a 60kg hull, thats got to be a lot more stress on the hulls than on the other models . time will tell i guess
> 
> oh and i have conversations with lawers and not backyard ones about this issue and supposedly hobie would not fair very well in the account of a misshap caused by a hull breach .in fact NO boat manufacturer would .
> 
> as ive started before i like hobies but i just dont think there safe yet .
> 
> craig
Click to expand...

Craig,

I suggest you get together with your lawyer mates, band up the 3 or 4 people with failures over the last 2 years.....and take Hobie on. Much more productive than all the hysteria and BS that gets written here by people who 'think' they know........

...or perhaps do some research on what the REAL failure rates are.......(whilst you may hear of 3 or 4 failures....I actually know how this compares with units sold and it don't smell at all of a critical safety issue endemic with the hulls despite what the ''experts'' on forums will tell you - I would suggest authorities would have found the same).

....or just purchase another make of yak and move on........

My point is all these people on forums, talking rubbish and half fact, does nothing but propagate and breed more rubbish and ill fact. Go and do something about it and then come back and tell us how well it all went.

Do not take it personally Craig....I just get sick of hearing the same old crap every couple of months about how it is against the law, the can't do that, Dept Of Fair Trading should make them recall....Blah blah... blah... Nobody has the intestinal fortitude to do anything about other than whinge on forums.

Again....I wonder why? ;-)


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## Peril

patwah said:


> Bollocks Bollocks Bollocks ????????????????????????
> 
> What are we going to do about the Sharks??


once again, the mods set the standard of debate. Spare us


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## Bart70

leftieant said:


> Craig, I think you should be *very* careful in claiming Hobie are facing a legal risk on this. Do you really think that they wouldn't have assessed their risk and position?
> 
> And as to the conversations you've had with *real* lawyers, again, be very, very careful. You are not in full possession of the facts, you are trying to form a legal opinion based on second and third hand information, and hearsay, and unless you've paid for said legal opinion, and have it in writing, it isn't worth a pinch.
> 
> Conspiracy theories do no-one any favours, least of all the person spouting them.
> 
> I suggest that if you really want to know what's going on, and get the full background on the story, you pick up the phone and call Hobie and have a chat directly to them. Cut out the rubbish, innuendo and rumours, and go straight to the source. Until you get actual facts, not hearsay, you achieve absolutely nothing out of continually dredging up this tired old chestnut, other than to reinforce other people's opinion of you.


Amen!!


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## craig51063

regarding the p.a,s reliabilaty ... time will tell :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

craig


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## Guest

Wokka wokka wokka :lol:


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## Greybeard

Bart70
Funny Greybeard,

They never said anything like that to me when mine was replaced?? Might have more to do with the content of the posts perhaps.....

Whats Funny about it they rang my wife and asked her to ask me to remove the post.
Might have had more to do with the circumstances surrounding the post. As my kayak split 6days before the forster fishing carnival last year and I thought I had no chance of getting a new yak after paying $500 for accommadation and entry fee, posted saying the facts and was never critical of anything or anyone. Then Steve Fields gets on and says they will bring a new kayak up for me. Now Iam dealing with Hobie Australia and not the dealer who i purchased the yak off. Which in hindsight turned out to be the the wrong deciscion and I should have declined but was keen to go to forster.And as things didn't work out with the change over and words where said thought that I better do some investigation in case we wound up at Fair trading. 
At forster of the 33 Kayaks 3 hobies had the problem and I have 128 pages printed out that are available to you if required from 2 australian sites and 1 American site of this problem with Hobies and did come acrosss the American Hobie site as stated earlier where access is denied.
Its useless to attempt legal action without evidence.And personnally Iam not interested.
But I do feel sorry for the people getting caught by people onselling their holed hobies to Newbies that are unwise of the problem which I know of 2.
As for the saftey side of it which I spoke to Steve Fields about at Forster he believed it stopped with the sticker on the kayak that states its a dangerous sport and all saftey rules apply eg PFD dont go out in bad weather, you know what I mean.
Cheers Greybeard


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## AdrianP

Back to the original post......

I keep my phone in a waterproof bag rather than a Pelican case so that it can be used on (or in the worst case, in) the water.

I also send a text to home if the launch location or any other details change.

Thanks for the other tips.

Adrian


----------



## justcrusin

Fill the unsed parts of your yak with bouyance foam. High density stuff not pool noodles.










Above is my prowler I filled the back end off with two part foam. In this photo the kayak is completely full of water well above the pools waterline. 
I would not reccomend this it almost ended in a tradgically for the yak. But get some high density bouyance closed cell foam. I use it now half a sheet of this stuff will float 144 kg's enough for most yakkers and there gear.

It has the added bonus of not letting the water once inside your kayak move around freely and stops the water sloshing to one side an decreasing stabilty.

Cheers Dave


----------



## Bart70

Greybeard said:


> At forster of the 33 Kayaks 3 hobies had the problem and I have 128 pages printed out that are available to you if required from 2 australian sites and 1 American site of this problem with Hobies and did come acrosss the American Hobie site as stated earlier where access is denied.


Happy to look at it if you have an electronic copy you can send? Will PM my email address if you do.



Greybeard said:


> But I do feel sorry for the people getting caught by people onselling their holed hobies to Newbies that are unwise of the problem which I know of 2.
> Cheers Greybeard


This I do agree with......whether it be a yak, a boat, a car or whatever......Selling something second hand that is faulty without disclosure is a low act.

Bart70


----------



## ScottLovig

Greybeard. your info on the Forster boats is plain wrong.

Stop gathering your information from forums. For every small wisdom they are loaded with the opinions of small minded and ignorant people with chips on their shoulders. Just posting puts you at risk of guilt by association. :twisted:

Cheers

Scott


----------



## bazzoo

ScottLovig said:


> Greybeard. your info on the Forster boats is plain wrong.
> 
> Stop gathering your information from forums. For every small wisdom they are loaded with the opinions of small minded and ignorant people with chips on their shoulders. Just posting puts you at risk of guilt by association. :twisted:
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Scott


Thanks a lot pal ,,,,,, not ,,,, i object strongly to this post , if thats the case Scott then why do you read the forum if your that far above it all AAAAHHHHRRRGGGHHHHHHH :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## justcrusin

I think what Scott is trying to say Baz is that, info from forums is mostly hearsay and not hard fact. Its basically the same as hearing info at the pub over a beer and taking it as gospel.

The rest of it is pretty true too, just put a little more in your face than most would like.

Cheers Dave


----------



## Shorty

Well its all sorted, Hobie came straight to the party as they have always done in the past 8)

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=36628


----------



## kayaksportsmark

justcrusin said:


> I think what Scott is trying to say Baz is that, info from forums is mostly hearsay and not hard fact. Its basically the same as hearing info at the pub over a beer and taking it as gospel.
> 
> The rest of it is pretty true too, just put a little more in your face than most would like.
> 
> Cheers Dave


Just Cruisin, did you actually ask Scott what he was trying to say or are you just coming up with your own interpretation not supported by hard fact? 
My interpretation of Scotts post was that he is implying Greybeard is guilty of being small minded and ignorant because he has posted a negative comment about a Hobie issue.
Bazzoo stating he takes offence is fair and based on his own interpretation.


----------



## justcrusin

> Just Cruisin, did you actually ask Scott what he was trying to say or are you just coming up with your own interpretation not supported by hard fact?


no, just hearsay like the rest of this topic



> Bazzoo stating he takes offence is fair and based on his own interpretation.


did I say something about baz's opinion, don't think i did. I gave another interpretation of the hearsay


----------



## kayaksportsmark

justcrusin said:


> .......The rest of it is pretty true too, just put a little more in your face than most would like.
> 
> Cheers Dave


The rest of it is true? which bit?



scottlovig said:


> Stop gathering your information from forums. For every small wisdom they are loaded with the *opinions of small minded and ignorant people with chips on their shoulders.* Just posting puts you at risk of guilt by association


----------



## FazerPete

kayaksportsmark said:


> justcrusin said:
> 
> 
> 
> .......The rest of it is pretty true too, just put a little more in your face than most would like.
> 
> Cheers Dave
> 
> 
> 
> The rest of it is true? which bit?
> 
> Stop gathering your information from forums. For every small wisdom they are loaded with the *opinions of small minded and ignorant people with chips on their shoulders.* Just posting puts you at risk of guilt by association
Click to expand...

I'm now going to believe everything I read on forums because I've been told not to believe what I read on forums...on a forum :? It's a double negative so therefore everything on forums must be right unless only very special people post the truth and the rest of us are small minded. ;-)


----------



## bazzoo

Dave , i appreciate your pouring oil on the troubled waters , but i am sick of this guy barging onto the forum when there is another Hobie problem , walking all over people' s feelings ,and contributing naught but criticism of the forum and its members , when he feels that the Hobie logo will be bismurched , its time we stood on our hind legs and barked back


----------



## Guest

Lady Gaga: Man or Muppet? 8)


----------



## Shorty

bazzoo said:


> , when he feels that the Hobie logo will be bismurched , its time we stood on our hind legs and barked back


Gee i learn new words every day,,cheers for that  
http://www.wordreference.com/definition/besmirched

In regards to Scott Lovig i camped next to him for 3 days on the weekend,,one of the nicest blokes around,,,he does get his back up about Hobie as anybody would expect a dealer to,,, 8)


----------



## ScottLovig

Dear Bazoo and others. Ive been active on this forum for nearly 4 years and there isnt much new for me to read as there once was.

I just stay to keep up with mates and watch out for peanuts that need sorting out. Unfortunatly for this once great forum there are plenty in the bowl.

Cheers

Scott


----------



## craig51063

Im amazed at some of the comments comming back on this forum .

everybody knows that these craft have reliability problems . fact

in the forster final 3 out of 18 craft failed and these were brand new .....leading into the comp , include ferals and greybeards , cookies thats 6 out of 33 craft . fact

the hulls crack on some of these craft not all but some .fact

now kittygogo was 2 ish ks off the coast when his hull failed him .lets face it he was lucky to get back .as he said the crack could have easerly turned into a hole .he had to bail the hull out 3or 4 times to get back . he could have been in real trouble . fact

if hobies didnt have this problem and stealth , viking or any other yak for that matter did would they be so blindly defended ?

craig

oh and what the hell are we going to do about the sharks


----------



## bazzoo

I do think it would be good if we could make Scott's post's a sticky under the heading of Scott Lovigs views on AKFF, so that all members could refer to it when they were feeling all warm and fuzzy ,and be brought back down to earth by a man who by his own admission has appointed himself judge and jury on the intelligence and character of most of the members of "this great forum " . No Scott i agree , it might'nt be as great as it used to be ,and i too have been a member her for around 4 years , but it certainly deserves more respect than you accord it in your last post and your previous offering. Scott, you dont have to just hang around here to be in contact if with your friends, why dont you just send emails to both of them , IE, the ego and the super ego .


----------



## craig51063

bazzoo said:


> I do think it would be good if we could make Scott's post's a sticky under the heading of Scott Lovigs views on AKFF, so that all members could refer to it when they were feeling all warm and fuzzy ,and be brought back down to earth by a man who by his own admission has appointed himself judge and jury on the intelligence and character of most of the members of "this great forum " . No Scott i agree , it might'nt be as great as it used to be ,and i too have been a member her for around 4 years , but it certainly deserves more respect than you accord it in your last post and your previous offering. Scott, you dont have to just hang around here to be in contact if with your friends, why dont you just send emails to both of them , IE, the ego and the super ego .


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

craig


----------



## ScottLovig

Re read the tread Bazoo It deserves no respect.

Greybeard has his facts wrong and Craig dosent even own a Hobie but is talking about legal action going on the advice of his mates next door...... :lol: :lol: :lol:..... [mod edit - personal]

Cheers

Scott


----------



## Bart70

craig51063 said:


> Im amazed at some of the comments comming back on this forum .
> 
> everybody knows that these craft have reliability problems . fact
> 
> in the forster final 3 out of 18 craft failed and these were brand new .....leading into the comp , include ferals and greybeards , cookies thats 6 out of 33 craft . fact
> 
> the hulls crack on some of these craft not all but some .fact
> 
> now kittygogo was 2 ish ks off the coast when his hull failed him .lets face it he was lucky to get back .as he said the crack could have easerly turned into a hole .he had to bail the hull out 3or 4 times to get back . he could have been in real trouble . fact
> 
> if hobies didnt have this problem and stealth , viking or any other yak for that matter did would they be so blindly defended ?
> 
> craig
> 
> oh and what the hell are we going to do about the sharks


As I said before Craig....anybody can spruke inuendo on a forum mate. Take your facts to the authorities and let the true professionals and experts deal with it.

That is the post I am more interested in reading. ;-)


----------



## Bart70

AdrianP said:


> Back to the original post......
> 
> I keep my phone in a waterproof bag rather than a Pelican case so that it can be used on (or in the worst case, in) the water.
> 
> I also send a text to home if the launch location or any other details change.
> 
> Thanks for the other tips.
> 
> Adrian


I have a waterproof VHF attached to my PFD .....When offshore I log on with the local VMR. Would have been handy for Neil to have one of these being so far offshore. Even if the leak had gotten so bad that he had to stop and continuously bail, he would have been able to do so knowing that the VMR were on their way with a vessel to pick him up.

Personally I believe if venturing into open water everyone should carry some form of reliable waterproof communications to alert authorities if needed - preferably a VHF so that nearby vessels can be alerted as well as the VMR.

Bart70


----------



## Bart70

Dallas said:


> Lady Gaga: Man or Muppet? 8)


Not sure.,..

Can you be arrested of ogling a Muppet?


----------



## Greybeard

ScottLovig said:


> Greybeard. your info on the Forster boats is plain wrong.
> 
> Stop gathering your information from forums. For every small wisdom they are loaded with the opinions of small minded and ignorant people with chips on their shoulders. Just posting puts you at risk of guilt by association. :twisted:
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Scott


Scott I am sorry that you feel this way but I will point out that after attemting to fish in my cracked kayak at forster and finding it full of water after 20 minutes and attempting to bail it out numerous times with a 1/2 coke can decided to return to the ramp and its not easy running down forster with the runnout tide and a kayak that needs emptying every 5 minutes and whilst waiting on the bank watched two more kayaks return and these people approached the hobie officials in attendance . [mod edit - off topic/inflamatory]. So my quotes are from fact and as stated there was many witness's to this .Scott I understand your passion for your product and as you would see I still use a hobie and everyone that asks me about kayak fishing I will tell them straight if you want to fish in a kayak get a hobie because if you don't get one straight up you will eventually wind up in one. But alas I still believe that there should have been a recall and one of the reasons for this is that one of the posts I have printed out from America is from a bloke asking if its safe to take his 3 year old daughter out in his hobie !
Cheers Greybeard


----------



## craig51063

geez there must be a few people sponsered by hobie or is that all a myth as well .

and who said anything about taking legal action

im also glad that hobie changed the disgn and strengened the system because only 3 or 4 people had minor problems with cracking hulls

unbelievable

craig


----------



## RedPhoenix

Guys,

Please try and keep this thread impersonal. Character assassinations (peanuts/*rseholes/gay/whatever), adds nothing to the topic, and puts it at high risk of a lockdown.

Keep it nice and level, and the discussion can continue.

Scotty: Appreciate the assistance mate, but if you think you see a 'peanut' that is not meeting forum guidelines, please hit the 'report a post' button, and let us help - your participation/involvement is VERY valuable in threads of this nature where you can help guide the discussion with a dealers perspective.

Ta. 

Red.


----------



## Guest

Bart70 said:


> Dallas said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lady Gaga: Man or Muppet? 8)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure.,..
> 
> Can you be arrested of ogling a Muppet?
Click to expand...

You might not get arrested, but if it turns out she really IS a man, you will feel dirty in the morning ;-)


----------



## bazzoo

Gentlemen , let me make myself clear here , my comments in the above posts were aimed at my perceived impressions of Scotts attitude to this forum and its members, i was in no way involving myself in the dispute over water ingressing a hobie hull , i dont paddle a Hobie so i am not qualified to comment on such things , and will leave that entirely to the Hobie pilots to sort out for themselves .


----------



## paffoh

craig51063 said:


> unbelievable


Whatever Sharkboi,






Oh and I wish I had such positive outcomes with other company's like this tale :
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=36628

Your dead set off your tree haters.


----------



## grinner

dave,
i quite like that idea of filling the yak with foam.
ive only completely drowned mine once and it floated just.

maybe also taking a big sponge as well.
do you think throwing 10 or 15 empty 2litre milk bottles in the hull would be an alternative

thats a damn good tip.

on a lighter note , dont try foam on your 4B


----------



## Greybeard

What else would you do if you cant fish But drink beer ?
Cheers Greybeard


----------



## bazzoo

Paff as some of the posts have been partly deleted it makes it hard to go back and look at the full content , but i repeat i am in no way criticising the Hobie Company or their product , to my mind this discussion was between Scott and myself regarding attitude . I think it may be time to calm down now guys and get on with SKI fishing


----------



## craig51063

after sinking 2or 3 ks out what were u expecting 
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=36628

as i said unbelievable

craig


----------



## paffoh

If you want to go down this path Leftie the whole thread needs a rimming, not deleteing posts and leaving others...

Facts only, remove the innuendo from others and keep it real...


----------



## Guest

eace: (now.... can I play with your rubber duckie?)


----------



## bazzoo

Sorry Paff dont agree i think if Leftie is going down this path and i applaud it , i would like to see the thread maintained in its entirety as it becomes too hard too follow if posts are edited , and i think its a first and important initiative and should be left as is . It would be quite dissapointing if any members that posted on this thread deleted all or part of their posts


----------



## bazzoo

Sorry i was bailing out on this one but considered it important to do the last post above


----------



## paffoh

bazzoo said:


> Sorry Paff dont agree i think if Leftie is going down this path and i applaud it , i would like to see the thread maintained in its entirety as it becomes too hard too follow if posts are edited , and i think its a first and important initiative and should be left as is . It would be quite dissapointing if any members that posted on this thread deleted all or part of their posts


Well easy to say when your posts defending your right to 'Free speech' remain when some of mine have been removed...

No worse than yours I might add, touche.


----------



## kayaksportsmark

If you want to start fresh, why not start a new post titled ask a question to Hobie? or similar.


----------



## Bart70

bazzoo said:


> , i dont paddle a Hobie


Awww Bazz....But you know you want to! :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Bart70

craig51063 said:


> geez there must be a few people sponsered by hobie or is that all a myth as well .


Hope you are not referring to me Craig......No sponsorship, in fact nothing at all from Hobie. I have never met Steve Fields nor spoken directly with him. If you were referring to me you are wrong...and those on here who know me also know you are wrong. My sincere apologies if this comment was not aimed towards me - is a bit hard to work out who people are aiming their responses at when threads get messy.



craig51063 said:


> and who said anything about taking legal action


Might have been me....sort of....I think I said that you should take your evidenence and 'proof'' away to the appropriate authorities to have it looked at by professionals who know their stuff instead of citing inuendo with the armchair lawyers on forums. I guess you could take that any way you liked.



craig51063 said:


> im also glad that hobie changed the disgn and strengened the system because only 3 or 4 people had minor problems with cracking hulls
> 
> unbelievable


Atta boy Craig....a much more positive attitude than implying that these things are sinking in their hundreds and people's lives are at risk when they get in one. I am proud that Hobie fall into line with many other major manufacturers and strive for product improvement. Most major car manufacturers do the same. Could be worse - they could be a cheap and nasty item produced in a developing nation with no support or backup at all......But then if they were they may not be where they are today wouldn't you think? ;-)

Bart70


----------



## Bart70

madfishman said:


> Good to see you made it back in ok and sorry to hear about the leak, sounds like it took on a lot of water on your trip.
> 
> As a *Hobie Cult *member ( and as expected, throwing my 2cents in) and Landrover owner, ( not landcruiser..booo hiss hiss) , i am pretty happy with the support from hobie in the past on different matters with friends and others ive heard and read in this forum , and as always good to see any company standing behind its products. When we were up in NSW a few weeks ago for the St bgeorges basin abt round Steve gave us a tour of the factory and i was not suprised at the passion and suppoort these guys offer all their customers, right through to the hobiecats that they make at the factory.
> 
> Good luck in the future .
> 
> Great post about safety and having the right gear on any vessel in the water, this should be mandatory and is the law..


Mate....You own a Hobie AND a Landrover??

What a glutton for punishment! :lol: :lol: :lol:

(Coming from an ex Landrover owner - reluctant sale, and a Hobie owner - but wont admit to be a Hobie Cult Member just yet....Still in the closet :lol: :lol: :lol: )

Bart70


----------



## Greybeard

Just to clarify a point here and correct me if Iam wrong I am thinking that Scott is refering to the hobies that where supplied for the Final I am refering to the first day at Forster the saturday I wasn't there for the Final and would not comment on that.
Cheers Greybeard


----------



## Peril

Mod edit - Please keep posts relevant to factual information.



> Leftiant said
> 
> # I don't want to hear a peep out of anyone about Hobie hulls cracking, splitting, leaking, spontaneously bursting into flames, unless you have had a direct experience with it (ie, you owned the craft it happened to). Keep your posts to factual information.


----------



## Shorty

ScottLovig said:


> I just stay to keep up with mates and watch out for peanuts that need sorting out.


My sisters always sorting the peanuts out as well,,did you know you can shake the jar or bag and the cashews will rise to the top ? Its a good trick to learn but its first in best dressed or you miss out,,,


----------



## Bart70

Peril said:


> Mod edit


Good post Peril,

It is clear that you do not have the time to waste taking it to the authorities because you do not waste your time posting inuendo and hearsay.

Again good post.

Bart70


----------



## yankatthebay

Peril said:


> While uncertainty remains, I view the craft as unfit for open water or large waterways and will not join anyone who chooses to take that risk and expect to be rescued should their hull fail. My loss perhaps, but I take Poseidon very seriously.


Clearly by the fact that even with a severe problem letting in water, the craft managed to be returned to shore without anyone needing to assist. I think this proves that the craft is indeed fit to be taken in open water. If the craft ended up simply sinking in a short period of time, then I would have to say otherwise - but that was not the case. Problems do happen, and I am sure some fibreglass hulls have suffered equally serious problems from time to time (like de-lamination, or simply a crack after running into something...both things which the hobie would not have such an issue with).


----------



## Ranger

It's unfortunate that someone has had a problem with their kayak, and I'm glad to hear that it didn't develop into a more serious or dangerous situation. It's also encouraging to see the manufacturer replaced the unit with a minimum of fuss, and I'm glad the user posted here to bring both the problem and the resolution to our attention.

I believe when it comes to user safety Hobie have also played their part in educating their customers with purchases. Just read your owners manual:


> SAFETY
> Paddlesports can be dangerous and physically demanding.
> The user of this product should understand that participating
> in paddlesports may involve serious injury or death. Observe
> the following safety standards when using this product.
> These are basic safety rules that all boaters should follow.
> Always use common sense and follow all safety rules at all
> times.
> • Consult your physician prior to beginning paddlesport /
> training.
> • Carry a spare paddle.
> • Obtain paddlesport instructions from your dealer specific to
> this type of craft.
> • Obtain certified first aid training and carry first aid and
> rescue/safety equipment.
> • Always wear a nationally approved personal flotation
> device.
> • Wear a helmet where appropriate.
> • Dress appropriately for weather conditions; cold water
> and/or weather can result in hypothermia.
> • Check your equipment prior to each use for signs of wear
> or failure.
> • Never paddle alone.
> • Always use a paddle leash.
> • Do not paddle in flood conditions.
> • Be aware of appropriate river water levels, tidal changes,
> dangerous currents, obstacles in and above the water and
> weather changes.
> • Scout unfamiliar waters; portage where appropriate.
> • Do not exceed your paddling ability; be aware of your
> limitations.
> • DO NOT use alcohol or mind-altering drugs prior to or while
> using this product.
> • Follow the manufacturer's recommendations for use of this
> product.
> • If additional outfitting is added to this craft, use
> manufacturer-approved materials only; do not impair entry
> or exit access.
> • Read owner's information package prior to using this
> product.
> The user of this product acknowledges both an
> understanding and assumption of the risk involved in
> paddlesports/paddling.
> Beware of offshore winds that may make it difficult to return
> to shore.
> When paddling in a new area, check with the locals regarding
> currents, shoreline conditions and weather patterns. Plan an
> "escape route" -- an alternative place to get off the water
> should environmental conditions dictate.
> Hobie Kayaks were not designed for fast moving water


Can I ask how many of us:
-Consulted our physicians before commencing paddlesports
-Carry a spare paddle
-Obtained certified first aid training
-Check our equipment prior to each use for signs of wear or failure
-Paddle alone
-Add additional outfitting using non manufacturer approved materials which may impair entry/exit access (rocket launcher, sounder, leashes, etc)
-Acknowledge the risks involved in kayaking
-Plan an escape route
-Avoid fast moving water

I know that I've ignored all these safety warnings, and I'd be willing to bet most of you have too. I guess that means if something happens to me out there, it's my own silly fault for ignoring the manufacturers warnings!

My own skew on this topic is that I'm aware some Hobie kayaks have cracked in the past (I have no idea how many or how often). I'm also aware that until now no-one has died or been injured as a result. I'm also informed that Hobie have addressed the issue in each case to owners satisfaction and offered good after sales service.

Armed with this knowledge I still chose to go out and purchase a Hobie kayak. I certainly hope it doesn't ever crack! If it does, I expect Hobie will come to the party and satisfactorily repair or replace the kayak for me, as they seem to have done for everyone else who has had a problem with one.

Under normal use, if I've adhered to all their safety warnings in my owners manual, I recon I should be pretty safe! I will have avoided fast moving water, I will have a companion craft with me at all times, I will have planned an escape route, I will have certified first aid training, and I'll be wearing a nationally approved personal flotation device. Plus I'll be adhering to all the other warnings they've made me aware of, which I have failed to list here. Safe as houses I recon, but if by some chance I should still die due to the failure of my craft, I've also acknowledged the risks involved, as per my owners manual.

I'm not a one eyed Hobie addict/supporter by any means. In fact, until about 12 months ago, I didn't even know what a Hobie was, but I'm happy with my Hobie.........very happy! It's one of the best purchases I've made recently, it's providing me with a lot of fun and it's increasing my fitness while providing me with more convenience than towing my boat around.

If you're not happy, then I'd suggest get rid of yours as quickly as you can! For others, if you are concerned about Hobies, then don't even consider purchase of one. We are all grown adults capable of making our own decisions and our own choices.

I'm not a hardcore kayaker dude! If I were, I think I would have purchased an ocean going sea kayak, capable of offshore work in all weather conditions, while I battle the sea and surf and travel vast distances, but certainly NOT a Hobie! Hobies are just pleasurecraft!

Instead of being the hardcore kayaker dude, I like to go out for a quiet paddle and a fish in rivers, estuaries, lakes and bays, solely for relaxation and enjoyment only, at a leasurely pace. I don't think I'll ever be more than 2 or 3 kilometres from shore in it, I'll be kayaking in good clear weather, and I'll be wearing a pfd1. I feel confident that my Hobie will deal with everything I expect of it. I feel confident that it has been well manufactured, and I also feel I will get good after sales service in the event I ever need it.

I do not believe my Hobie is the greatest thing in watersports, is bulletproof or is free from failure or breakage. Then again, neither is my house, my car, my wife, my kids, my dog or my toaster, and I'm happy with all of them too!

I also believe there is room for improvement with my Hobie. I have some ideas on things which could be changed/altered/modified/added to make it even better, but at the moment I believe it is the most suitable thing on the market for my own intended purpose and product satisfaction.

I could list products I've purchased over the years which have not been to my satisfaction, have let me down, and have even endangered me, but I'm afraid that would be a very very long list, involving everything from motor vehicles to socks.

It's fine for everyone to have their say on a topic if they can provide useful input or ideas, but arguing the point here, going for each others throats, speculating, whinging and backbiting does little for our enjoyment, it does little for the website and it does little to promote our sport. It brings down the dealers, it rubbishes the product and it also belittles the members involved. There's more and more of it going on though, so I recon I'll just back out of this arguement once again now that I've had the chance to say my own piece, and while you all relaunch the attack, I might go out for a quiet paddle instead, coz it's beautiful weather here.

While I'm out, I'm gonna work on my sailing, coz I recon one day I might consider upgrading to one of them Adventure Island thingys with the outriggers and the sail. I can make these type of decisions for myself, and I can research all my purchases beforehand so that I walk into everything with my eyes open! I am then responsible for my own decisions, and if I am not completely satisfied with any purchase, I am also capable of taking it up with the manufacturer and fighting for satisfaction.

I hope you're all happy with your own kayaks of choice, and I seriously hope no-one ever suffers misadventure or serious equipment failure in any craft of any design!

If any Hobie dealer/representative reading can answer me just one question before I wade out of this discussion, I have but one concern I'd like to have addressed:
If by chance my kayak did ever happen to develop a crack around a stress area, can you provide me with a guarantee that it will be either repaired or replaced promptly and free of charge?


----------



## mattyp

Well said Ranger!
Couldn't agree more.
Enjoy your sail.


----------



## craig450

> # Likewise, not a peep out of the Hobie crew unless you have useful, factual information to contribute.


Asked to edit by Craig450, Cheers Dave


----------



## craig51063

> # I don't want to hear a peep out of anyone about Hobie hulls cracking, splitting, leaking, spontaneously bursting into flames, unless you have had a direct experience with it (ie, you owned the craft it happened to). Keep your posts to factual information.


Mod edit


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## craig51063

> # I don't want to hear a peep out of anyone about Hobie hulls cracking, splitting, leaking, spontaneously bursting into flames, unless you have had a direct experience with it (ie, you owned the craft it happened to). Keep your posts to factual information.


mod edit


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## craig51063

craig450 said:


> # Likewise, not a peep out of the Hobie crew unless you have useful, factual information to contribute.
> 
> 
> 
> Asked to edit by Craig450, Cheers Dave
Click to expand...

no i didnt


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## paffoh

At no time did you constantly refer to their older design Craig51063, you just keep hammering away at the company...

Seriously, with a little turn of phrase your posts could be quite special, but I find your rush to try and get your point accross infuriating.

Your claiming to spruik facts but your sarcastic, inherent responses veto this topic in more ways than one, how can you expect to get into some sort of social debate on something you obviously feel so passionate about when your initial claims of fame are so hastily written. I can't defend a product I have no financial interest in but I can defend a product I have had over four years using, maintaining and perfecting its use. Apart from owning a 2006 Hobie Quest, a 2009 Pro Angler, a 2010 Adventure I also own a 2006 Outiftter with not one but TWO (Thats two) Mirage drives with the old style cam points and this kayak has never been back to a dealer or had signs of water ingress befitting a rapid description. If you want to now live in the past and quite older model problems you need to be specific from the start, not vague and impossible. You want to claim facts, well claim this...

The user had an issue, Hobie replaced the hull as it was in warranty and the new user already recieved a replacement, not only that, but the user went on one of the largest kayak fishing forums in the world to inform on both negative and positive results. You have now gone WAY out of your way to defame a company, its policy, its sight unseen, its heart and soul (Customer alliance) just to get some point across that Hobie kayaks have been known to have issues in the past. As mentioned before use a fact and show me another manufacturer that would ave the problem sorted in less than 72 hours (Less given logistics) and I might refrain from desent a little, BLA, Daiwa, Loomis and Nitro dont even come close the the aftersales service offered by Hobie (And the before mentioned companies can be top notch). I dont think anyone mentioned the retro kit was offered free from Hobie and fitted by Hobie and I also cant recall anyone having an issue once the retrofit was installed (Is it a fact, well I cant recall). (Mod edit)

The whole 'Told you so' attitude stinks and its amazing other members have appeared out of the woodwork to cause inflamation. Mods want the path clear for posts like Rangers (Nice post mate, top stuff) but in the silvery mist we spy a land shark, biting off more than he can chew. I dont speak to you as anything more than a member of AKFF and a Hobie user (Three kayaks +), my affiliation beyond that is neglible during this conversation (And so should Scott's and anyone else classed as a 'Fan Boy'). You want heated debate start offtopic shenanagins, stay away from fire otherwise you will get burnt. The moral ground is just to god damn high on this topic, thank god were not pissed and at a pub. There is currently a free steering upgrade drum for the Pro Angler and I can say with the utmost confidence that this is an upgradable feature dependant on the users needs and wants, its free and comes no questions asked (Without it the hull wont become brittle and crack). Until you sit on a Hobie, have knowledge of owning one and put one through its paces on a daily basis (Including travel to and from) then you have no personal basis to contribute to a brand bashing propoganda agenda, its passed judgement at its worse and is therefore not worth listening to...


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## justcrusin

LOCKING this until tomorrow so we can get some sleep


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## Guest

[Mod Edit - irrelevant]

[User Edit - Mod edited, my point exactly!]


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## craig51063

paffoh said:


> At no time did you constantly refer to their older design Craig51063, you just keep hammering away at the company...
> 
> Seriously, with a little turn of phrase your posts could be quite special, but I find your rush to try and get your point accross infuriating.
> 
> Your claiming to spruik facts but your sarcastic, inherent responses veto this topic in more ways than one, how can you expect to get into some sort of social debate on something you obviously feel so passionate about when your initial claims of fame are so hastily written. I can't defend a product I have no financial interest in but I can defend a product I have had over four years using, maintaining and perfecting its use. Apart from owning a 2006 Hobie Quest, a 2009 Pro Angler, a 2010 Adventure I also own a 2006 Outiftter with not one but TWO (Thats two) Mirage drives with the old style cam points and this kayak has never been back to a dealer or had signs of water ingress befitting a rapid description. If you want to now live in the past and quite older model problems you need to be specific from the start, not vague and impossible. You want to claim facts, well claim this...
> 
> The user had an issue, Hobie replaced the hull as it was in warranty and the new user already recieved a replacement, not only that, but the user went on one of the largest kayak fishing forums in the world to inform on both negative and positive results. You have now gone WAY out of your way to defame a company, its policy, its sight unseen, its heart and soul (Customer alliance) just to get some point across that Hobie kayaks have been known to have issues in the past. As mentioned before use a fact and show me another manufacturer that would ave the problem sorted in less than 72 hours (Less given logistics) and I might refrain from desent a little, BLA, Daiwa, Loomis and Nitro dont even come close the the aftersales service offered by Hobie (And the before mentioned companies can be top notch). I dont think anyone mentioned the retro kit was offered free from Hobie and fitted by Hobie and I also cant recall anyone having an issue once the retrofit was installed (Is it a fact, well I cant recall). (Mod edit)
> 
> The whole 'Told you so' attitude stinks and its amazing other members have appeared out of the woodwork to cause inflamation. Mods want the path clear for posts like Rangers (Nice post mate, top stuff) but in the silvery mist we spy a land shark, biting off more than he can chew. I dont speak to you as anything more than a member of AKFF and a Hobie user (Three kayaks +), my affiliation beyond that is neglible during this conversation (And so should Scott's and anyone else classed as a 'Fan Boy'). You want heated debate start offtopic shenanagins, stay away from fire otherwise you will get burnt. The moral ground is just to god damn high on this topic, thank god were not pissed and at a pub. There is currently a free steering upgrade drum for the Pro Angler and I can say with the utmost confidence that this is an upgradable feature dependant on the users needs and wants, its free and comes no questions asked (Without it the hull wont become brittle and crack). Until you sit on a Hobie, have knowledge of owning one and put one through its paces on a daily basis (Including travel to and from) then you have no personal basis to contribute to a brand bashing propoganda agenda, its passed judgement at its worse and is therefore not worth listening to...


paffo 
i thought i made it very clear that i was talking about the older models on the 1st page i state ... i believe they have changed the disign and added stainless steel clips to add strength to the area ....i also said .... its good that hobie have acteded on a disign fault so shouldnt they recall the mirage drive yaks [ the old ones cause u would not recall the new ones ] and also on the 3rd page .... 3 or 4 times in the last 2 years [ thats old ones ]

my writing style is short and sharp so i can see how some of what i write can get misinterpreted but i dont undersand why u get infuriated by it .

if im a bit over zelous well i apolagise but beiing in the s.e.s i have been exposed to real life situations like having to retreave on seperate occasions, 3 dead ,drowned bodies out of jindy and eucembene lake during the 90s, after staying down for nearly 2 weeks u could imagine the condition ..... i guess im a bit educated and feerfull of what can and can does happen on our waterways .

i have ALWAYS STATED that i like hobie and they have great customer service ... were have i said otherwise

i also notice that on page 3 ,you started abusing me on that page calling me a TOOL and say i dont think they like you .... i was talking about hobie yaks not the company .also copping more flack from u on page 6. so if i started writing back and being narky well then i apoligise but i guess u started it first .

now on page 7 u are threatening me with .... "stay away or you will get burnt" and "thank god where not pissed and at a pub " .

is that bullying ,i think so ....................

as ive stated many times in this post

unbelievable

craig


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## Davey G

OK, folks....

Seems that some of you simply don't know when/how to stop and I think that everyone who has had something to contribute has now done so, and frankly this is creating way too much work/headaches for the mod team so I'll make it simple...

Lockdown time.

However, we're happy for this discussion to continue but as some people are questioning the validity of other members comments, we now invite an official Hobie spokesman to start up a thread *'Hobie Hull Issues - The Facts' *where hopefully they can give us some 'official' information instead of relying on misguided gossip and misinformation from 'forum peanuts'..

Perhaps they can advise exactly what the hull issues are, how many and what models have been affected, which year models were involved and what they have done/will do about this for any future issues. Hopefully that will help to clear the air and present some factual information direct from the company (which is what seems to annoy the Hobie reps in these threads). So we're happy to offer an invite to one of the Hobie lads to step up and give us the facts..

To provide another viewpoint we'd also invite Hobie owners who have been affected to tell us their experiences and provide information on what happened and how their problems were dealt with.

This debate/argument has been going on for 5 years and frankly I think we're all a bit over it so here's the chance for everyone to provide the facts and get the info out there and end this debate once and for all. Please note that this future thread will also be heavily moderated to ensure it doesnt go off the rails like many of these seem to do.

So, there you go, the invite is now out there to Hobie...take it up if you wish.


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