# Safety For a New kayaker sit on or sit in?



## Jumpstart (Jun 4, 2011)

Just curious to what people think is safer for a new kayaker, sit in or sit on?


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## jokinna (Mar 2, 2010)

i'm sure ive seen this post elsewhere


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## Eberbachl (Jun 21, 2007)

It's been discussed at length 

The common misconception by people with little understanding of kayaks and their uses is that SOTs are safer. I'm betting the poll results will illustrate that too. The fact is that there are safe and unsafe SIKs _and_ SOTs, depending on where you're paddling, and what you're doing. It's not about SIKs or SOTs - it's about hull design and the yak's intended use.

With a little training both can be very safe. The SIK has you with a lower centre of gravity - so given a similar hull design is more stable, and it also reduces your exposure to the elements. Given the inherent stability with a low centre of gravity in a SIK you can create a faster hull with less initial stability (but great secondary stability). Additionally, in rough water it's desirable to have less initial stability (and good secondary stability) to keep you safe, and this is more acehievable in a SIK.

Why is less initial stability desirable in rough water? Initial stability describes the initial feeling of stability in a yak - does it feel tippy at rest, or does it feel like a very stable platform? Secondary stability actually describes how easy it is to go past the point of no return and actually capsize a yak. You can have great initial and secondary stability, good stability at one level and poor at another, or poor at both. If you have low initial stability for example, the kayak will feel a bit tippy at rest, but if it has good secondary stability it will allow you to lean a long way, and will have a nice secure feeling edge to lean on before it capsizes. Similary, you can have a kayak that feels very stable at rest (good initial stability), but if you lean a little it just flips and capsizes (poor secondary stability).

In flat water, good initial stability is nice, and secondary stability is often not as important. If you go out in rough water with swell, surf and chop, good initial stability is actually a bad thing, as the yak wants to tip and roll with the waves, causing you to unbalance and increasing the risk of a capsize. In rough water with low initial stability, you have more give, and can easily stay upright in these conditions, and good secondary stability becomes important.

Consider the following diagrams, which illustrate my point:

Flat Bottom (good initial stability):









Round Bottom: (low initial stability):








Images taken from http://www.splashdance.com/before_buying.htm

The thing with a SIK is that without any practice or training, they can be a little more difficult to self rescue than a SOT, but with a (VERY) little technique and some practice, wet exits, self rescue - and even rolling (given the right boat) are quite easy and very acheivable.

A lot depends on what you want from your yak, and the type of fishing you want to do.



A SOT is not for everyone, and neither is a SIK.


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## jokinna (Mar 2, 2010)

well thats detail for ya. and should sum it up i reckon.

me... i like no stability :lol:


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## solatree (May 30, 2008)

White water - a SIK any day. But for fishing, I certainly recommend a SOT.


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## Chilli (Jul 2, 2011)

Hey Eberbachl... with the Initial and Secondary stability weigh ups... is there a component of speed to do with this. I mean if you ahve poor initial stability is it easier to get a good "plane" on your yak and get it going faster over longer and/or through rougher terrain? Whats the sacrifices speed and manouverability wise for determining which yak is better than another? For me when i upgrade (cmorn Ms Gillard) my yellow brick to good SOT it will be used 80% fishing and 20% carrying camping gear and fishing... i would assume initial stability is important but how much speed am i sacrificing? Also are we beyond the initial/secondary with the modern yak yet?


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## kayakone (Dec 7, 2010)

Eberbachl said:


> It's been discussed at length
> The common misconception by people with little understanding of kayaks and their uses is that SOTs are safer. I'm betting the poll results will illustrate that too. The fact is that there are safe and unsafe SIKs _and_ SOTs, depending on where you're paddling, and what you're doing. It's not about SIKs or SOTs - it's about hull design and the yak's intended use.
> With a little training both can be very safe.
> A lot depends on what you want from your yak, and the type of fishing you want to do.
> ...


And there are safe and unsafe yakkers too. It is also about skills. Not too many yakkers talk about learning skills like edging, sweep strokes, reverse rudders, bracing etc. These are worthwhile pursuits. You can learn them from canoe clubs or professionals (accredited kayak instructors, & from other yakkers)

Then there is secondary safety, like what to do when you're overboard. What techniques, what gear will reduce the impact from disaster to minor dunking?
I think the speed of a yak, SOT or SIK, fast/slow, length/width, etc are all down in priority to the above. But they are important.

Here's another one: learning how to interpret weather _forecasts_ and _observations_. There is a difference...viewtopic.php?f=9&t=52407

All good fun if it doesn't turn ugly.

Have a great day.
Trevor


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## dru (Dec 13, 2008)

For a starter fishing yak, SOT hands down the right way to start.

For a starter kayak, it depends on what you want to do and how much coaching you are interested in. There is no doubt at all in my mind that a SOT is safer for a nube.


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